Balancing width vs driving style

[Elfenstar]

I just heard something new recently and though you guys might be interested.

 

I know most of us love having larger rims (which means wider tires too).

I'm sure most of us would know that wider tires have less grip in the wet as more water has to be channelled out? We also know that lower sidewall flex from lower profile tyres aids in cornering too.

 

However did you know what tires too wide are bad for cornering??? The reason being that the same force will be distributed across a larger area if the tires are wider resulting in lower traction. The balance bit comes in from too much force across a too small an area will mean total loss of traction if you push the car too hard.

 

What are your thoughts?

[Secondhand]

Are u sure??? Ppl keeps saying wider tyres better grip leh... I mean handling and all... If it is really bad, then why change to wide tyres in the 1st place?

[Elfenstar]

Thats what i heard about cornering. The key is balance (if true) to match your driving style.

 

I know in the dry, wider tires give lots more grip as its harder to get wheelspin. I assumed it would be better in cornereing too but just heard that they aren't, but only if they're too wide.

[Secondhand]

Donno... My friend from MY told me his wide tyres didn't fail him during a road race... Either he got a good tyre or he was drifting ard the corners... Anywayz, if wider tyres gonna sacrifice FC, then I'm not gonna change to those tyres...

[Elfenstar]

We'll have to wait for someone more knowledgeable, but thus far it does make sense to a certain extent.

[EventH]

I am not an expert but here is my point of view.

 

A tire looses traction when the lateral forces (when you go around a corner) overcomes the contact between the tire and the road surface. A set of wider tires with a supposedly larger contact patch will experience lesser pressure (force/unit area), hence less likely to give way.

 

In addition the wider tires usually has lower profile (not MPV/SUV) less sidewall flex also.

More confidance in a corner.

 

Aquaplaning another story all together.

[Octopus]

  Quote

I just heard something new recently and though you guys might be interested.

 

I know most of us love having larger rims (which means wider tires too).

I'm sure most of us would know that wider tires have less grip in the wet as more water has to be channelled out? We also know that lower sidewall flex from lower profile tyres aids in cornering too.

 

However did you know what tires too wide are bad for cornering??? The reason being that the same force will be distributed across a larger area if the tires are wider resulting in lower traction. The balance bit comes in from too much force across a too small an area will mean total loss of traction if you push the car too hard.

 

What are your thoughts?

But I believe wide tyres are good for cornering cos have more surface area and therefore more grip. When doing cornering the centrifugal force is forcing the car to 'fly outward', and the wider tyres allows more contact between tyres and road and hence more grip.

[Elfenstar]

Hmmz... looks like you all share my original view... i guess it would prolly be right, but lets hear from a few more ppl. I would rather be sure on this than not really know as tires definately affect safety and considering the way i drive, thats pretty high up on my priority list.

[Elfenstar]

What about traction levels, would it be lower in a wider tire than in a narrower one?? I do understand about the traction loss (and agree), but i believe what i was told was refering to traction levels.

[Eyke]

  Quote

What are your thoughts?

 

no thoughts, just some test results:

 

 

Tuning makes driving safer: This is the result of a comparison test made by the VDAT e.V., the German Automobile Tuners Association, in cooperation with tire manufacturer Dunlop. This test included brake tests on the German Dunlop testing ground in Wittlich with two identical VW Golf 4, one equipped with 15-inch standard tires while the other was rolling on 18-inch low profile tires. The results on dry and wet track speak highly of the tuning version: On dry asphalt the Golf with 18-inch tires stopped after 40.3 meters from a speed of 100 km/h while the car with 15-inch standard tires required a 4.1 meters longer stopping distance. The wide tuning tires also dominated on the wet track: From a speed of 80 km/h the vehicle with 18-inch tuning tires required a 2.9 meters shorter stopping distance with 27.6 meters.

 

"With this test we wanted to prove that tuning using wide tires doesn't only have an optical effect but especially further improves the active safety of a car", VDAT Member of the Board Michael Lauer explains the motivation to carry out this series of tests.

 

VDAT member Dunlop was the competent partner for this test. The German branch of the tire manufacturer didn't only provide the tires but also their testing ground which is perfectly suited for this kind of tests.

 

The tests were made using two identical VW Golf 4 cars with standard suspension. One car was equipped with its standard Dunlop SP Sport 200 tires in 195/65 R 15 size. The second car was equipped with 8Jx18 BBS light alloy wheels and Dunlop SP Sport 9000 225/40 ZR 18 wide tires.

 

"The advantages of wide tires in comparison with slimmer standard tires become especially obvious at braking", knows Dipl. Ing. Harald Schmid, who is responsible for the technical development for tuners at Dunlop. "Due to their larger tire contact area, the softer rubber compound and the lower flexing energy of wide tires the decelerating forces can be better transmitted on the road. As a result the stopping distances become much shorter. In addition the directional control is way better in the case of drastic braking and thus the car can be controlled more easily."

 

The difference between the two tire dimensions is remarkable: At an ABS-controlled full braking from 100 km/h the VW Golf 4 with 225/40 ZR 18 wide tires came to a standstill after exactly 40.3 meters. The car with 195/65 R 15 standard tires required a stopping distance of 44.4 meters. At the point where the car with the tuning wheel/tire combination already came to a standstill, the car with 15-inch tires was already 30.5 km/h fast. "You can easily imagine that this huge difference in speed can decide on life or death for a pedestrian, a cyclist or of course for the passengers of this car themselves", Michael Lauer from the VDAT e.V. explains.

 

The comparison test of the VDAT e.V. and Dunlop also disproves the old prejudice that wide tires are inferior to slimmer tires on wet roads. "When both tires have the same tread depth the wide tires have clear advantages at braking and handling", Dunlop technician Harald Schmid explains. "The test results give a definitive proof."

 

At full braking with ABS from a speed of 80 km/h the Golf with 18-inch tires came to a standstill after 27.6 meters on the wet track. The car with 15-inch tires required 30.5 meters for the same braking test and was still 24.6 km/h fast when the car with tuning tires was already standing.

 

"So we have the proof that tuning causes higher safety on the road", VDAT Managing Director Michael Lauer knows. "Wide tires are not only made for decoration! They can also save lives and can protect from heavy injuries. But this can only come true when every motorist doesn't only take care that his car is equipped with certified wheel/tire combinations with perfect free travel to the bodywork. A sufficient tread depth and especially a correct tire pressure is equally important."

 

VDAT / Dunlop brake comparison test between standard tires and tuning wheel/tire combination

 

The measured values:

 

Braking with ABS from 100 km/h on dry road

------------------------------------------

Tire Dimension Stopping Distance Deceleration Remaining Speed

195/65 R 15_______44.4 m_______8.69 m/s______30.5 km/h

225/40 R 18_______40.3 m_______9.58 m/s_______0.0 km/h

 

 

Braking with ABS from 80 km/h on wet road

-----------------------------------------

Tire Dimension Stopping Distance Deceleration Remaining Speed

195/65 R 15_______30.5 m_______8.09 m/s______24.9 km/h

225/40 R 18_______27.6 m_______8.95 m/s_______0.0 km/h

Edited July 6, 2005 by Eyke

[Elfenstar]

Thanks for that!!!

[Kelpie]

  Quote

I just heard something new recently and though you guys might be interested.....

What are your thoughts?

 

IMHO there is no logic, if not all the F1 cars would be using tiny tires.

 

Regards,

[Elfenstar]

better to be safe than sorry lah its tyres, and i definately dun play around with those.