Is it really cheaper to own an EV?

[Tianmo]

On 7/5/2024 at 3:19 PM, inlinesix said:

Hybrid is neither here nor there.

😜

 

 

On 7/5/2024 at 3:32 PM, Kklee said:

IMHO.
Neither here nor there is PHEV. 🤣

 

On 7/5/2024 at 3:39 PM, inlinesix said:

PHEV & HEV are the same breed la.

Neither here nor there.

Technically, the current HEV is not even consider a hybrid, it is at the most an extended ICE vehicle aka EICE. PHEV is the one closer to be consider a hybrid. 

The current Hybrid simply added a small battery and motor connected to the engine to reduce Fuel consumption and improve range. It still depends on petrol to drive it, and cannot drive on electricity alone if there is no petrol. Something added to improve something is technically an extension, not a hybrid. 

The PHEV, on the other hand, can run on both electricity only or as an extended ICE vehicle running on petrol, that is what a real hybrid is. Because a hybrid is basically a mixture of 2 elements, and carry characteristics of both elements, you can say it is neither here nor there, but it is also true that it is also here and there. 

Best of both world, and worst of both world is technically the same thing, depending on what happens to you when you use it.

 

[Tianmo]

On 7/3/2024 at 11:41 AM, Lala81 said:

We'll see lor.
This is not digital technology, material engineering doesn't really move so fast. 

All these architecture stuff was just not incorporated cos there was no need for it to do so when EV adoption is just starting. It's just something already in the pipeline. 

Anyway SS batteries are as with all new things, overhyped. More importantly is how to refine existing technologies. 

By looking at what the PRC automobile industry is doing, I think they saw or knew what is important. Just look at what they are producing now after all the 3.8sec, 2.8sec hoohay. 

Scaling down, that's where the money is, mass market. And yes, just by refining what they have now is good enough to take big market shares. 

EV is supposed to replace ICE, not creating something far away from it. Tesla made EV a technology toy, but the Chinese are making it into a transportation instrument, the difference is clearly there now. Cheaper, slower EVs with longer ranges, that's what will be coming, all base off some adjustments to the current tech only. 2.8sec 3.8sec  all just a statement, who really needs or can manage. 

 

[Kklee]

On 7/5/2024 at 4:49 PM, Tianmo said:

 

 

Technically, the current HEV is not even consider a hybrid, it is at the most an extended ICE vehicle aka EICE. PHEV is the one closer to be consider a hybrid. 

The current Hybrid simply added a small battery and motor connected to the engine to reduce Fuel consumption and improve range. It still depends on petrol to drive it, and cannot drive on electricity alone if there is no petrol. Something added to improve something is technically an extension, not a hybrid. 

The PHEV, on the other hand, can run on both electricity only or as an extended ICE vehicle running on petrol, that is what a real hybrid is. Because a hybrid is basically a mixture of 2 elements, and carry characteristics of both elements, you can say it is neither here nor there, but it is also true that it is also here and there. 

Best of both world, and worst of both world is technically the same thing, depending on what happens to you when you use it.

 

IMHO.
Hybrid rough definition is combine 2 or more things.
AFIAK,  Toyota HEV can run on battery with engine off and not as per what you describe as cannot drive on electricity alone.
Toyota PHEV basically is the same thing just that bigger battery and charger.

 

[steveting99]

In 2023, around 26 manufacturers have BEV available for sale in Singapore. From Audi all the way down to Volvo, with many in names in-between. Competition is a wonderful thing and Singaporeans are now spoilt on choice. 

In 2024, more Chinese BEV manufacturers with their name brands are going to join in the fight for market share here in Singapore. Can hardly wait for Zeekr to bring in the 009 and X - it's going to shake things up a bit for establishment.

Edited July 5 by steveting99
typo

[Rskc]

Actually, I am just thinking if this thread is even a non starter cos it is obvious the govt while tries to push everyone towards EV (via VES/EEAI subsidy), it is not going to give up too much revenue from ICE or EV. It would balance the revenue from 1 form or the other. E.g. ICE expensive fuel, cheaper road tax vs EV cheaper energy refill/much higher road tax.

[Beanoyip]

I saw a few places in SG have 7kw free charging

[Terence2112]

On 7/7/2024 at 8:49 AM, Beanoyip said:

I saw a few places in SG have 7kw free charging

There is free charging in SG? Where is it? Can share? 

Edited July 7 by Terence2112

[balshankar]

@kobayashiGT I have a different opinion on use of EV in Singapore based on car price of similar size (dimensions L/W/H) and power (in KW). There is cost difference in Petrol/Hybrid/EV vehicles. EV seems to be priced more than Hybrid and Petrol probably becos of new Tech. Refer to the attached file for car price comparisons. If I were to own a EV car, I would break even or save only if were to use the car for move than 1500KM a month

[Kklee]

On 7/7/2024 at 5:53 PM, balshankar said:

@kobayashiGT I have a different opinion on use of EV in Singapore based on car price of similar size (dimensions L/W/H) and power (in KW). There is cost difference in Petrol/Hybrid/EV vehicles. EV seems to be priced more than Hybrid and Petrol probably becos of new Tech. Refer to the attached file for car price comparisons. If I were to own a EV car, I would break even or save only if were to use the car for move than 1500KM a month

IMHO.
Price in ascending order,  Toyota Altis $158,888, BYD Seal $180,888 and Toyota Prius $191,888
Based on your calculation,  cost/km is petrol 17.9 cents,  9,2 cents and 11.5 cents.

If based on 1500km per month,  10 years will be 180,000 km.

Cost of Petrol/Electricity over 180,000km
Toyota Altis -  $32,220
BYD Seal - $16,560
Toyota Prius - $20,700

Vehicle cost + fuel cost 
Toyota Altis - $191,108
BYD Seal - $197,488
Toyota Prius - $212,588

P.S.  If i calculated salah, please let me know. 🤣

 

 

[inlinesix]

On 7/7/2024 at 9:00 PM, Kklee said:

IMHO.
Price in ascending order,  Toyota Altis $158,888, BYD Seal $180,888 and Toyota Prius $191,888
Based on your calculation,  cost/km is petrol 17.9 cents,  9,2 cents and 11.5 cents.

If based on 1500km per month,  10 years will be 180,000 km.

Cost of Petrol/Electricity over 180,000km
Toyota Altis -  $32,220
BYD Seal - $16,560
Toyota Prius - $20,700

Vehicle cost + fuel cost 
Toyota Altis - $191,108
BYD Seal - $197,488
Toyota Prius - $212,588

P.S.  If i calculated salah, please let me know. 🤣

Ora Good Cat is cheaper than Altis.

But both cars has similar depreciation.

[Kklee]

On 7/7/2024 at 9:03 PM, inlinesix said:

Ora Good Cat is cheaper than Altis.

But both cars has similar depreciation.

IMHO.
Ternary lithium battery - for me is no no. 

[Beanoyip]

On 7/7/2024 at 5:39 PM, Terence2112 said:

There is free charging in SG? Where is it? Can share? 

I filter 'free' on plugshare, there are a few, but not sure how true. 

[therock]

On 7/7/2024 at 5:53 PM, balshankar said:

@kobayashiGT I have a different opinion on use of EV in Singapore based on car price of similar size (dimensions L/W/H) and power (in KW). There is cost difference in Petrol/Hybrid/EV vehicles. EV seems to be priced more than Hybrid and Petrol probably becos of new Tech. Refer to the attached file for car price comparisons. If I were to own a EV car, I would break even or save only if were to use the car for move than 1500KM a month

This is very interesting bro

i wonder if you can consider battery costs

your BYD battery costs 30k and the Prius battery costs 8-10k

of course some will say it’s unlikely but does that make the running cost different?

we haven’t added maintenance costs but it should be higher for the corolla even if the buyer scrimps on maintenance 

 

 

[kobayashiGT]

On 7/7/2024 at 9:00 PM, Kklee said:

IMHO.
Price in ascending order,  Toyota Altis $158,888, BYD Seal $180,888 and Toyota Prius $191,888
Based on your calculation,  cost/km is petrol 17.9 cents,  9,2 cents and 11.5 cents.

If based on 1500km per month,  10 years will be 180,000 km.

Cost of Petrol/Electricity over 180,000km
Toyota Altis -  $32,220
BYD Seal - $16,560
Toyota Prius - $20,700

Vehicle cost + fuel cost 
Toyota Altis - $191,108
BYD Seal - $197,488
Toyota Prius - $212,588

P.S.  If i calculated salah, please let me know. 🤣

 

 

EV will be cheaper in the long run, as there is no servicing also.

but that is if you drive the car for 10 years straight. if you are selling an ev down the road, maybe the resale won't be that good. 

[inlinesix]

On 7/8/2024 at 9:01 AM, kobayashiGT said:

EV will be cheaper in the long run, as there is no servicing also.

but that is if you drive the car for 10 years straight. if you are selling an ev down the road, maybe the resale won't be that good. 

EV is the cheapest car in the market now.

[Terence2112]

@inlinesix 

the Aion Y is the cheapest car being offered now. 

[Kklee]

On 7/8/2024 at 9:01 AM, kobayashiGT said:

EV will be cheaper in the long run, as there is no servicing also.

but that is if you drive the car for 10 years straight. if you are selling an ev down the road, maybe the resale won't be that good. 

IMHO.
Range anxiety aside, I would say EV would be what some drivers of ICE looked for in a car - just that they maybe do not admit. 🤔

[Kklee]

On 7/7/2024 at 9:00 PM, Kklee said:

IMHO.
Price in ascending order,  Toyota Altis $158,888, BYD Seal $180,888 and Toyota Prius $191,888
Based on your calculation,  cost/km is petrol 17.9 cents,  9,2 cents and 11.5 cents.

If based on 1500km per month,  10 years will be 180,000 km.

Cost of Petrol/Electricity over 180,000km
Toyota Altis -  $32,220
BYD Seal - $16,560
Toyota Prius - $20,700

Vehicle cost + fuel cost 
Toyota Altis - $191,108
BYD Seal - $197,488
Toyota Prius - $212,588

P.S.  If i calculated salah, please let me know. 🤣

 

 

IMHO.

Vehicle cost + fuel cost + road tax 
Toyota Altis - $191,108 + $7,920 = $199,028
BYD Seal - $197,488 + $15,020 =  $212,508
Toyota Prius - $212,588 + $9,760 = $222,348