No one wants used EVs, making new ones a tougher sell too

[RadX]

On 1/31/2024 at 11:09 AM, Voodooman said:

Whatever the scepticism here and contrary to the thread title, sales of new EV here grew 50% in 2023, albeit from a small base and now 18% of new vehicles registered are pure EV.  Pretty impressive given the charging infrastructure is not exactly there yet, at least not in all public car parks.

 

https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/companies-markets/transport-logistics/singapores-ev-registrations-surge-505-5468-2023

Yes this was where I was at yesterday and a good mixture of ppl. We have mall, charge operators, MOT and LTa along with us end users

 

productive and looking forward to new rules to drive the “etiquette “ forward

 

I did also raise my “trickling charge” but no conclusion😂… the main concerns arE the DCs

[mersaylee]

On 1/31/2024 at 11:32 AM, RadX said:

Yes this was where I was at yesterday and a good mixture of ppl. We have mall, charge operators, MOT and LTa along with us end users

 

productive and looking forward to new rules to drive the “etiquette “ forward

 

I did also raise my “trickling charge” but no conclusion😂… the main concerns arE the DCs

Anyone there use this...? 😁

[ccc888]

On 1/31/2024 at 11:09 AM, Voodooman said:

Whatever the scepticism here and contrary to the thread title, sales of new EV here grew 50% in 2023, albeit from a small base and now 18% of new vehicles registered are pure EV.  Pretty impressive given the charging infrastructure is not exactly there yet, at least not in all public car parks.

 

https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/companies-markets/transport-logistics/singapores-ev-registrations-surge-505-5468-2023

I also can cherry pick and say EV demand slump liao hahaha….EU is pioneer in EV adoption and their figures carry more weight imo.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-01-18/europe-car-sales-drop-in-december-led-by-electric-vehicle-slump

[Vratenza]

only in SG, the EV subsidies are ownself give own self subsidies (yet makan by ADs) which is reflected in the paper value when selling later.

 

[RadX]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:11 PM, mersaylee said:

Anyone there use this...? 😁

i saw this in one table

 

[mersaylee]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:37 PM, RadX said:

i saw this in one table

 

So Soya was there as well...?😁

[Vratenza]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:11 PM, mersaylee said:

Anyone there use this...? 😁

eh... I think MOT and LTA probably bring this lah...

[hansmith]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:34 PM, Vratenza said:

only in SG, the EV subsidies are ownself give own self subsidies (yet makan by ADs) which is reflected in the paper value when selling later.

 

yes, i don't quite like this part too (Tesla SG excluded as they do not makan it).

 

Edited January 31, 2024 by hansmith

[Volvobrick]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:22 PM, ccc888 said:

I also can cherry pick and say EV demand slump liao hahaha….EU is pioneer in EV adoption and their figures carry more weight imo.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-01-18/europe-car-sales-drop-in-december-led-by-electric-vehicle-slump

Yeah.  Less EV/PHEV sold in Germany in 23 vs 22. Will it indicate what other market will be become? I will wait for lelong.... 

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/industry-pain-abounds-electric-car-demand-hits-slowdown-2024-01-30/

"Meanwhile, German EV sales, including plug-in hybrid models, fell 16% last year and are forecast to drop another 9% in 2024, including a 14% decline for pure battery EVs, according to German auto association VDA." 

[Vratenza]

On 1/31/2024 at 1:24 PM, hansmith said:

yes, i don't quite like this part too (Tesla SG excluded as they do not makan it).

 

I guess that is the least Tesla can do... 

Quote

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/business/elon-musk-tesla-pay-package-us56-billion-unfathomable-4087096

 

[Beregond]

On 1/31/2024 at 1:24 PM, hansmith said:

yes, i don't quite like this part too (Tesla SG excluded as they do not makan it).

 

I dun see it that way. I feel its just part of the marketing.

Over all for us end user. Its the overall cost of the car and the specs  that counts. 

I not expert. 

But lets say Car A sell 10k 

Car B same spec sell 20k. Then they say they absorb gst, they give u back all the subside etc etc.  No point right? 

Edited January 31, 2024 by Beregond

[Voodooman]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:22 PM, ccc888 said:

I also can cherry pick and say EV demand slump liao hahaha….EU is pioneer in EV adoption and their figures carry more weight imo.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-01-18/europe-car-sales-drop-in-december-led-by-electric-vehicle-slump

I am not talking about EU and it is one year SG data instead of 1 month. 

Dec 23 - everything in Europe went down vs Dec 22, including sales of petrol vehicles as the German economy, the largest car market in EU, is in the dump.

Talk about cherry picking. 😂

[Lethalstrike]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:34 PM, Vratenza said:

only in SG, the EV subsidies are ownself give own self subsidies (yet makan by ADs) which is reflected in the paper value when selling later.

Greatest joke is the high road tax for EVs with the additional flat component to make up for lost petrol excise duties. Only Singapore 😁

[Beregond]

On 1/31/2024 at 3:56 PM, Lethalstrike said:

Greatest joke is the high road tax for EVs with the additional flat component to make up for lost petrol excise duties. Only Singapore 😁

That's why all laugh at the car light plan.

Imagine all cars are replace by bicycle. 

I can imagine all the funny funny tax gonna come out. Or maybe gst 20 %

😂😂😂

[Jtis]

On 1/31/2024 at 9:16 AM, Lethalstrike said:

If you're charging on DC, there is no way to set your charging speed. The car will simply charge as fast as it possibly can based on what the charger can provide. 

If it's AC, I think the only way is to reduce the charging amperage settings in your car. This will effectively put a cap to the max possible charging speed on the onboard charger of your car (responsible for converting AC to DC). 

Agree, for DC charging, you can't adjust charge rate AFAIK. The reason why you can adjust charge rate for AC charging via the charge current(amperage), is because the AC-to-DC converter is on the car itself, whereas for DC, the AC-to-DC converter is inside the EV charger itself, the dc charge is pushed directly to the car battery.

[Jtis]

On 1/31/2024 at 11:32 AM, RadX said:

Yes this was where I was at yesterday and a good mixture of ppl. We have mall, charge operators, MOT and LTa along with us end users

 

productive and looking forward to new rules to drive the “etiquette “ forward

 

I did also raise my “trickling charge” but no conclusion😂… the main concerns arE the DCs

Actually, my view is DC charger hogging is the main issue. Less so for AC charging, although some ppl may disagree.

For DC charging, there is no excuse, a full charge is like 30-40mins max? Anyone should be able to manage their time to unplug their charging, since it is so short. Compared with AC charging which is like 6-7hrs easily for a full charge. It can sometimes be hard to predict with certainty your availability to unplug 6-7hrs later, unless you are resting at home. Timing the charge to match when your work meeting ends and when you can pop out to unplug, isn't an unforgiveable sin in my opinion.

I brought this up quite a while back, that the solution has to be pervasive planting of cheaper slower(like 3.7kW or 7.4kW) AC chargers, at places where ppl spend more time. Eg. Home, offices etc. Why bother with 22kW or 43kW AC, when only very few cars (eg BYD E6) can max that out? There is a place for DC charging, but it cannot be taking wholesale from other countries experience, because sg drivers don't travel vast distances from one town to another.

[RadX]

On 1/31/2024 at 6:11 PM, Jtis said:

Actually, my view is DC charger hogging is the main issue. Less so for AC charging, although some ppl may disagree.

For DC charging, there is no excuse, a full charge is like 30-40mins max? Anyone should be able to manage their time to unplug their charging, since it is so short. Compared with AC charging which is like 6-7hrs easily for a full charge. It can sometimes be hard to predict with certainty your availability to unplug 6-7hrs later, unless you are resting at home. Timing the charge to match when your work meeting ends and when you can pop out to unplug, isn't an unforgiveable sin in my opinion.

I brought this up quite a while back, that the solution has to be pervasive planting of cheaper slower(like 3.7kW or 7.4kW) AC chargers, at places where ppl spend more time. Eg. Home, offices etc. Why bother with 22kW or 43kW AC, when only very few cars (eg BYD E6) can max that out? There is a place for DC charging, but it cannot be taking wholesale from other countries experience, because sg drivers don't travel vast distances from one town to another.

Exactly mentioned yesterday and the 43kw are phased out and think the 22kw as well

 

so the battle of the 3.7 and 7.4, good to have both as if I were to use my car on a 3.7, would take 15hrs? So some of the plausible suggestions incl having a variety of both 3.8/7.4 in MSCP and more AC vs DC

 

thus with more 3.7, can have more chargers in the block 

 

as for timing , the car app shd show. That’s how I can “cheat” my time by adjusting amps and seeing the “estimated” time left to the desired %

[Tianmo]

On 1/31/2024 at 7:04 PM, RadX said:

Exactly mentioned yesterday and the 43kw are phased out and think the 22kw as well

 

so the battle of the 3.7 and 7.4, good to have both as if I were to use my car on a 3.7, would take 15hrs? So some of the plausible suggestions incl having a variety in MSCP and more AC vs DC

 

thus with more 3.7, can have more chargers in the block 

If tomorrow they convert my estate MSCP whole level 6A into EV chargers, I cfm convert to EV also.  I don't mind 3.7 since I can park and charge every night peacefully. 

 

Edited January 31, 2024 by Tianmo