Intestate succession

[Columbian78]

I am sure most know about Intestate Succession, the basics of what happen if a person goes off without a will.

But what happens when the entire family (parents and kids) pass away together, for example due to an accident.

Lets say a typical family of 4 (Mr/Mrs XX and 2 kids) with no wills. Each of Mr and Mrs XX have their own relatives (parents and siblings, etc).

Both Mr and Mrs XX each have their own individual assets as well as shared (joint account, HDB).

So they went holiday and died in an air crash or road accident. Lets say all died on the spot and it cannot be determined who died first.

I read somewhere that in such case, it is assumed the wife survived the husband, i.e. husband die first. But not sure true or not, and applicable here in sg?

So basically in this case, all the family money incl husbands will eventually end up with the wife's family.

I think Mr XX probably is ok all his money goes to his spouse and kids if he were to die. But if the whole family do not survive, he would want his money to go to his own parents or siblings.

Of course there can be variations to the accident like all pass away at different time.

Can enlighten me?

 

 

 

[RadX]

Suggest you attend some of the free talks in wills and LPA and you will be well informed

most that I attended addressed this issue Ad nauseum and there are ways that they determine who died first etc. legal clauses notwithstanding 

 

too long for me to write here but a quick google can offer enlightenment 

[t0y0ta]

So lesson is best to have a will?

[BanCoe]

On 4/3/2023 at 5:00 PM, t0y0ta said:

So lesson is best to have a will?

Not issue of Will but whole family wiped out ....... guess it would be his/ her  parents and siblings next in line   

[Jamesc]

Hmmm wife's family gets it all?

Sounds like it was all planned by the MIL to arrange the accident.

[Jamesc]

https://www.moneysense.gov.sg/articles/2018/10/intestacy-what-if-you-dont-have-an-estate-plan#:~:text=Brothers and sisters get everything,children can claim their share.&text=Grandparents will each get the estate in equal portions.&text=Uncles and aunts get the estate in equal portions.

 

[Jamesc]

Muslims will be by Muslim laws.

[RadX]

On 4/3/2023 at 5:05 PM, BanCoe said:

Not issue of Will but whole family wiped out ....... guess it would be his/ her  parents and siblings next in line   

Intestate takes place when one has no will!

 

so if there is a will, it takes precedence

 

fr what I understand 

[RadX]

https://www.moneysense.gov.sg/articles/2018/10/intestacy-what-if-you-dont-have-an-estate-plan

[serenade]

Don't die without a Will. A bad will is still better than no Will. 

Don't try and save the $300 to make a Will. Your beneficiaries will spend much more than $300 in legal fees and spend lots more time to get their inheritance when there is no Will.

From the time you die till the time when the Letter of Admin/ Grant of Probate is issued, what will your dependants live on since your bank accounts are frozen. Not so much an issue if your children are adults and working. If they are in university/Poly with high fees, then how? 

[Voodooman]

On 4/3/2023 at 4:35 PM, Columbian78 said:

I am sure most know about Intestate Succession, the basics of what happen if a person goes off without a will.

But what happens when the entire family (parents and kids) pass away together, for example due to an accident.

Lets say a typical family of 4 (Mr/Mrs XX and 2 kids) with no wills. Each of Mr and Mrs XX have their own relatives (parents and siblings, etc).

Both Mr and Mrs XX each have their own individual assets as well as shared (joint account, HDB).

So they went holiday and died in an air crash or road accident. Lets say all died on the spot and it cannot be determined who died first.

I read somewhere that in such case, it is assumed the wife survived the husband, i.e. husband die first. But not sure true or not, and applicable here in sg?

So basically in this case, all the family money incl husbands will eventually end up with the wife's family.

I think Mr XX probably is ok all his money goes to his spouse and kids if he were to die. But if the whole family do not survive, he would want his money to go to his own parents or siblings.

Of course there can be variations to the accident like all pass away at different time.

Can enlighten me?

 

 

 

Really? I don't need my money to enrich my MIL and given her age, my wife's siblings.  They are already very rich, don't need my contribution.

So if there is a will and all beneficiaries died with me in an air crash, who gets the estate?  

How to cater to such remote event in a will?  

[Jamesc]

Make a will stop MIL getting it all!

Immoral of the story.

Edited April 3, 2023 by Jamesc

[Volvobrick]

On 4/3/2023 at 6:03 PM, Voodooman said:

Really? I don't need my money to enrich my MIL and given her age, my wife's siblings.  They are already very rich, don't need my contribution.

So if there is a will and all beneficiaries died with me in an air crash, who gets the estate?  

How to cater to such remote event in a will?  

Will go to the next closest relative(s) of the ultimate (youngest) beneficiary. As long as they can prove the relationships, they should get it. I think. 

Could be some distant uncles/cousins.

There were some cases before, eg some sisters with trust money died with no decedents nor will. 

 

[Lala81]

Quote

 

Rules for distribution

7.  In effecting such distribution, the following rules shall be observed:

Rule 1

   If an intestate dies leaving a surviving spouse, no issue and no parent, the spouse shall be entitled to the whole of the estate.

Rule 2

   If an intestate dies leaving a surviving spouse and issue, the spouse shall be entitled to one-half of the estate.

Rule 3

   Subject to the rights of the surviving spouse, if any, the estate (both as to the undistributed portion and the reversionary interest) of an intestate who leaves issue shall be distributed by equal portions per stirpes to and amongst the children of the person dying intestate and such persons as legally represent those children, in case any of those children be then dead.

   Proviso No. (1) — The persons who legally represent the children of an intestate are their descendants and not their next‑of‑kin.

   Proviso No. (2) — Descendants of the intestate to the remotest degree stand in the place of their parent or other ancestor, and take according to their stocks the share which he or she would have taken.

Rule 4

   If an intestate dies leaving a surviving spouse and no issue but a parent or parents, the spouse shall be entitled to one-half of the estate and the parent or parents to the other half of the estate.

Rule 5

   If there are no descendants, the parent or parents of the intestate shall take the estate, in equal portions if there be 2 parents, subject to the rights of the surviving spouse (if any) as provided in rule 4.

Rule 6

  If there are no surviving spouse, descendants or parents, the brothers and sisters and children of deceased brothers or sisters of the intestate shall share the estate in equal portions between the brothers and sisters and the children of any deceased brother or sister shall take according to their stocks the share which the deceased brother or sister would have taken.

Rule 7

   If there are no surviving spouse, descendants, parents, brothers and sisters or children of such brothers and sisters but grandparents of the intestate, the grandparents shall take the whole of the estate in equal portions.

Rule 8

   If there are no surviving spouse, descendants, parents, brothers and sisters or their children or grandparents but uncles and aunts of the intestate, the uncles and aunts shall take the whole of the estate in equal portions.

Rule 9

   In default of distribution under rules 1 to 8, the Government shall be entitled to the whole of the estate.

 

[Wt_know]

any company / law firm to recommend for writing will?

need to pass down my BTC and hopefully can hits $1M per coin

Edited April 3, 2023 by Wt_know

[Victor68]

On 4/3/2023 at 5:18 PM, RadX said:

Intestate takes place when one has no will!

 

so if there is a will, it takes precedence

 

fr what I understand 

Person writing will must not part of interest. Not I say one. 😆

[RadX]

On 4/3/2023 at 6:56 PM, Victor68 said:

Person writing will must not part of interest. Not I say one. 😆

Never ever get relatives … get indpt best pals better 

[Fcw75]

On 4/3/2023 at 6:50 PM, Wt_know said:

any company / law firm to recommend for writing will?

need to pass down my BTC and hopefully can hits $1M per coin

Use chatgpt. 🤪

Joke aside, I saw this while researching on LPA.

https://www.mltanlaw.com/promotions/detail/will-lpa

Edited April 3, 2023 by Fcw75