Should I get a new car or renew COE?

[13177]

On 6/26/2024 at 8:37 AM, Ginyu said:

Before buy car, ask yourself this question,  if no more job still can keep it then go ahead🤣

Think no one will think until so far. Just buy first then say later. 😂

[Jamesc]

On 6/26/2024 at 9:37 AM, Ginyu said:

Before buy car, ask yourself this question,  if no more job still can keep it then go ahead🤣

If no more job can do phv.

Maybe only job left is phv.

[Jamesc]

On 11/7/2022 at 1:49 PM, Koster said:

Whats so magical in 3 years' time that will cause COE to drop?

CN invade TW.

[Beehive3783]

On 6/25/2024 at 4:02 PM, Columbian78 said:

My current car 10 years in a few months time so I am at that stage that requires action soon.

Likely not buying a new car cos of high current prices and also none of the new cars really interest me enough to make me want to pay for it now.

So its either renew coe or get a second hand car with a couple remaining years so I can delay my decision.

2nd hand car I am looking at jap SUV like forester.

Renew coe option of 5 years or 10. I am ok with my current car though I may need to spend some thousands to change certain parts that I believe will not hold on for too long (coiovers and brake parts, etc). I don't think my car is problem free at this stage, but I am familiar with it and the things I had done so quite confident can handle it when things break. It is a very common Sylphy b17 but engine is rarer (1618cc turbo) and hopefully no serious failure modes that dunk it. I previously had a hard time finding someone able and willing to tune it.

 

Anyway, renew coe 5 or 10 years huh? If you guys know unlikely to drive the car more than 5 more years, just simply renew 5 years right? Renew 5 years also can get back coe rebate before 5 years linearly right?

Ok so you're still driving the 1.6 turbo

If i were you:

car condition tip top = renew COE

if renew COE, renew 10 years, do not renew 5 years (you spread your forfeited PARF rebate over 5 years instead of 10)

if you renew 5 years: must scrap after the 5 years, cannot renew anymore.

if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end. 

Given that yours is a rare item 1.6 turbo sedan, I would renew 10 years COE for sure. 

Edited June 26, 2024 by Beehive3783

[Beehive3783]

On 6/25/2024 at 7:21 PM, Ct3833 said:

@Columbian78 MCF standard is to change new car, cash payment some more 😄.

Unless money is  not a concern, otherwise on the serious note, basing on thw current COE trend and in anticipation (or hope?) that COE price may come down in 2 to 3 years time,  common sense is to either renew COE or to buy a 7 or 8 yo used car.

For your case, since you are contemplating to change from a sedan to a SUV, then it makes sense to change to a used SUV. But be aware that you will be buying into a car with uncertain  maintemance and reliability  background, so ensure you shop for a car from a trustworthy dealer, still, be prepared for some repair in a worst case scenario.

Depre wise, since you are buying used, the depre will be higher than renewing COE of your current car.

Cheapest and surest option will be to renew COE of your existing car, your parf write off should be  about 5k to 6k ? So even assuming you drive for 2 years before you sell it or scrap it, your depre will be very low. If you drive it for 3 years before you buy your next new car, the depre will be even lower. Plus, you know your car history well, you roughly  can anticipate the amount you may have to spend for wear and tear.  COE wise, if money is not a constraint, it is always good to renew for 10 years, after all you can get back the unused portion of COE. Otherwise, 5 years should be good enough to tie you till COE decline, if it does not, then make  alternative  plan by then.

 

There are lots of people who regretted renewing 5 years COE, because by the end of 5 years, they are stuck in no man's land and wish they had renewed 10 years instead. 

A lot of performance JDMs were killed by ignorant YPs who couldn't afford 10 year renewals.

[Ginyu]

On 6/26/2024 at 10:17 AM, Jamesc said:

If no more job can do phv.

Maybe only job left is phv.

You want strangers to sit in your precious car meh? 🤣 

[L23]

On 6/26/2024 at 10:20 AM, Jamesc said:

CN invade TW.

If Russia cant even swallow Ukraine in 2 years, i guess China may need more than 5 years then...😄

Edited June 26, 2024 by L23

[Columbian78]

On 6/26/2024 at 1:46 PM, Beehive3783 said:

Ok so you're still driving the 1.6 turbo

If i were you:

car condition tip top = renew COE

if renew COE, renew 10 years, do not renew 5 years (you spread your forfeited PARF rebate over 5 years instead of 10)

if you renew 5 years: must scrap after the 5 years, cannot renew anymore.

if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end. 

Given that yours is a rare item 1.6 turbo sedan, I would renew 10 years COE for sure. 

Hi, yes still driving the 1.6t.

Car condition not tip top but I know the car well enough (vs buying another old car).

I am considering renewing coe for this car only becos of economical reason and waiting for better car (nothing I like now), not becos I want to keep it.

I only really want to stretch it for a while more. Unlikely I want to drive it >5 years more, never mind renew coe again after 20 years.

Sorry I am confuse by your "if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end."

I thought once you renew coe (regardless 5 or 10 years), all parf rebate gone? Thats LTA's intention wasn't it? To incentivise people to drive newer cars.

The OMV is 20k. So If i don't renew coe, I get back 10k (50%) when I scrap it now (10th year). Once I renew coe, when I scrap the car, i get back the pro-rated 2nd coe only. Is this correct?

 

[Mkl22]

On 6/26/2024 at 4:55 PM, Columbian78 said:

Hi, yes still driving the 1.6t.

Car condition not tip top but I know the car well enough (vs buying another old car).

I am considering renewing coe for this car only becos of economical reason and waiting for better car (nothing I like now), not becos I want to keep it.

I only really want to stretch it for a while more. Unlikely I want to drive it >5 years more, never mind renew coe again after 20 years.

Sorry I am confuse by your "if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end."

I thought once you renew coe (regardless 5 or 10 years), all parf rebate gone? Thats LTA's intention wasn't it? To incentivise people to drive newer cars.

The OMV is 20k. So If i don't renew coe, I get back 10k (50%) when I scrap it now (10th year). Once I renew coe, when I scrap the car, i get back the pro-rated 2nd coe only. Is this correct?

 

Coe and parf rebate are NOT linked. Parf is gone if you don’t export/scrap or deregister before it turns 10years old. Coe is like you say prorated when you deregister.

an example. If at 9.5years old you decide to renew coe. You forgo the balance of the original coe and the new coe takes over. But if you then decide to dereg at 9.99years old. You still get back PARF and the prorated balance of the new coe. 
 

if you feel rich, and want to donate to LTA. You can also renew 10year coe every month! 🤣

Edited June 26, 2024 by Mkl22

[inlinesix]

On 6/26/2024 at 4:55 PM, Columbian78 said:

Hi, yes still driving the 1.6t.

Car condition not tip top but I know the car well enough (vs buying another old car).

I am considering renewing coe for this car only becos of economical reason and waiting for better car (nothing I like now), not becos I want to keep it.

I only really want to stretch it for a while more. Unlikely I want to drive it >5 years more, never mind renew coe again after 20 years.

Sorry I am confuse by your "if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end."

I thought once you renew coe (regardless 5 or 10 years), all parf rebate gone? Thats LTA's intention wasn't it? To incentivise people to drive newer cars.

The OMV is 20k. So If i don't renew coe, I get back 10k (50%) when I scrap it now (10th year). Once I renew coe, when I scrap the car, i get back the pro-rated 2nd coe only. Is this correct?

If you don't find anything you like (brand new), it will be harder to find later.

As long as your car is less than 10 years, you will have PARF.

Beyond 10 years, it is ZERO.

 

[Toeknee_33]

On 6/26/2024 at 4:55 PM, Columbian78 said:

Hi, yes still driving the 1.6t.

Car condition not tip top but I know the car well enough (vs buying another old car).

I am considering renewing coe for this car only becos of economical reason and waiting for better car (nothing I like now), not becos I want to keep it.

I only really want to stretch it for a while more. Unlikely I want to drive it >5 years more, never mind renew coe again after 20 years.

Sorry I am confuse by your "if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end."

I thought once you renew coe (regardless 5 or 10 years), all parf rebate gone? Thats LTA's intention wasn't it? To incentivise people to drive newer cars.

The OMV is 20k. So If i don't renew coe, I get back 10k (50%) when I scrap it now (10th year). Once I renew coe, when I scrap the car, i get back the pro-rated 2nd coe only. Is this correct?

 

Look at your ARF paid, not your OMV. The PARF is 50% of your ARF.

[Toeknee_33]

On 6/26/2024 at 5:34 PM, inlinesix said:

If you don't find anything you like (brand new), it will be harder to find later.

As long as your car is less than 10 years, you will have PARF.

Beyond 10 years, it is ZERO.

 

Yes I was browsing SGCM, and found no car of interest in the mid-priced categories. Now mostly small-engined hybrids and EVs. Car choices strangled by LTA's VES. 

[Mkl22]

On 6/26/2024 at 7:10 PM, Toeknee_33 said:

Yes I was browsing SGCM, and found no car of interest in the mid-priced categories. Now mostly small-engined hybrids and EVs. Car choices strangled by LTA's VES. 

One thing about VES is that the ARF and hence PARF becomes low. Thus encourages coe renewals. Can be a good or bad thing. More renewals means less coe for new cars but also lowers overall cost. Bad for ah gong cause cannot collect customs duties, ARF, GST again. 🤣

[Jamesc]

On 6/26/2024 at 3:01 PM, Ginyu said:

You want strangers to sit in your precious car meh? 🤣 

Cannot get stranger than my MIL.

Edited June 26, 2024 by Jamesc

[inlinesix]

On 6/26/2024 at 7:15 PM, Mkl22 said:

One thing about VES is that the ARF and hence PARF becomes low. Thus encourages coe renewals. Can be a good or bad thing. More renewals means less coe for new cars but also lowers overall cost. Bad for ah gong cause cannot collect customs duties, ARF, GST again. 🤣

The intention of VES is good except that consumers never benefit from it.

[Lala81]

On 6/25/2024 at 4:02 PM, Columbian78 said:

My current car 10 years in a few months time so I am at that stage that requires action soon.

Likely not buying a new car cos of high current prices and also none of the new cars really interest me enough to make me want to pay for it now.

So its either renew coe or get a second hand car with a couple remaining years so I can delay my decision.

2nd hand car I am looking at jap SUV like forester.

Renew coe option of 5 years or 10. I am ok with my current car though I may need to spend some thousands to change certain parts that I believe will not hold on for too long (coiovers and brake parts, etc). I don't think my car is problem free at this stage, but I am familiar with it and the things I had done so quite confident can handle it when things break. It is a very common Sylphy b17 but engine is rarer (1618cc turbo) and hopefully no serious failure modes that dunk it. I previously had a hard time finding someone able and willing to tune it.

 

Anyway, renew coe 5 or 10 years huh? If you guys know unlikely to drive the car more than 5 more years, just simply renew 5 years right? Renew 5 years also can get back coe rebate before 5 years linearly right?

My car is Jan 2025 expire. For me the parf is more significant. So forgoing it would be a major consideration. 

If I renew and buy a 7-8 year car, potentially I may go back to one vehicle in few years time once my younger kid is out of pri school. Or switch to a more elderly friendly vehicle when my parents are too old. 

Nothing against EVs, just that the infrastructure at my current work or home locations, I don't think will be more than adequate in the next 3 years if I do get an EV. Maybe in 5-8 years time it would be different. 

I have an elantra expiring in may 2028. Almost certainly I would renew that. Cos that would be the most economical option to own a car. 

If I renew both Coe, then I can potentially scrap any at any point in time. 

Below is my as realistic as possible breakdown, assuming I renew. Based on assumption of Coe 85k which may not happen given this level. 

 

Quote

Parf 16.1k. Forfeit. 
Renew Coe assuming 85k Coe.
Depre is 8.5k per year for Coe. If assume drive until 20 years. Depre would be only 10.1k per year. 
Current road tax is 1210
Added road tax is 10% more +121, 242, 363, 484, 605 per year accumulating.
Not included maintenance cost. 

If say change car in Jan 2027. Depre would be (17000 + 16100 + 363 extra road tax)/2 =  
16.7k per year.
If change Jan 2028, depre = 14.1k per year. 
 

 

[Beehive3783]

On 6/26/2024 at 4:55 PM, Columbian78 said:

Hi, yes still driving the 1.6t.

Car condition not tip top but I know the car well enough (vs buying another old car). **ok**

I am considering renewing coe for this car only becos of economical reason and waiting for better car (nothing I like now), not becos I want to keep it. **so you are considering to renew the COE only because of financial reason, i suppose it has been giving you many problems over the years? but will you love it again if you put in some money to fix the problems and make it good to drive again?**

I only really want to stretch it for a while more. Unlikely I want to drive it >5 years more, never mind renew coe again after 20 years. **if that's the case, don't waste time renewing 5 years, scrap it and get a PARF car with maybe 2 or 3 years or COE left, at least you still get PARF rebate at the end**

Sorry I am confuse by your "if you renew 10 years, you get back prorated PQP paid if you decide to scrap anytime within the 10 years (same for 5 years renewal) + the added advantage the COE is renewable for second time if you choose to ride it out till the end." **PQP refers to prevailing quota premium, aka price paid for COE renewal. nothing to do with PARF rebate**

I thought once you renew coe (regardless 5 or 10 years), all parf rebate gone? Thats LTA's intention wasn't it? To incentivise people to drive newer cars. **yes your understanding is correct, refer to @Mkl22's reply for detailed explanation

The OMV is 20k. So If i don't renew coe, I get back 10k (50%) when I scrap it now (10th year). Once I renew coe, when I scrap the car, i get back the pro-rated 2nd coe only. Is this correct? **PARF rebate is based on ARF, not OMV, what's your ARF paid? if you scrap now, you get back PARF rebate + balance prorated COE rebate. Again @Mkl22 has detailed explanation on this**

 

See my input in bold

Maybe I put it this way. If you're considering renewing COE based on financial reason, then might as well go ahead and renew it. Because the depre of fun cars have more than doubled in the past few years. Are you willing to stretch your budget for a car you will like?

Even if you go for a 2nd hand Forester, I am quite sure the depreciation will be quite a bit more compared to your Sylphy with 10 year renewed COE. Not to mention the hidden risks that you may have to face (unless you get one in very good condition).

That being said, if you know you are facing major gearbox or engine problems with the Sylphy, my advice is to get rid of it without renewing COE. Other parts can be repaired/replaced without big hits to the wallet. For old cars, undercarriage parts are very common wear and tear parts.

Edited June 27, 2024 by Beehive3783

[Beehive3783]

@Columbian78 another point to consider:

Assuming you renew COE at PQP 100K, PARF rebate 5k, so total 105K for 10 years. Add in loan interest (depending how much you borrow), we round it up to, say 11k depre?

The key point is, can you get a better PARF car for 11k depre? If you can't, then do you wanna stretch yourself to look for one with higher depre, or renew COE for existing car? 

 

**holy shit my current COE car's depre is only 6.7k and that is with loan interest factored in, i can't imagine doubling my budget for the next car**

Edited June 27, 2024 by Beehive3783