Yewheng Twincharged August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 http://tklcloud.com/Feedback/feedback2.aspx?id=336 Hmm.. Tkl View.. Actually quite reasonable.. ↡ Advertisement Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wind30 Turbocharged August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Voodooman said: Err.....Surely you can read the intent behind my post. You are back tracking on your position. You were saying we can't do anything to stop Indians from flooding our job market. My point was we are already doing it. Can u show me where I said we can’t do anything? I am pretty sure my stand all along is we cannot just tear but the ceca. We can try to work around it, renegotiate it, etc. But we have to follow the obligation laid out in ceca unless India agrees to change the terms. that was what CCS was trying to explain during the elections by asking what can Singapore bring to the table for renegotiating. I also don’t think it is as easy to work around it as some of you would made it out to be else it does make such agreements pointless isn’t it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodooman Supersonic August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 4 hours ago, Wind30 said: Can u show me where I said we can’t do anything? I am pretty sure my stand all along is we cannot just tear but the ceca. We can try to work around it, renegotiate it, etc. But we have to follow the obligation laid out in ceca unless India agrees to change the terms. that was what CCS was trying to explain during the elections by asking what can Singapore bring to the table for renegotiating. I also don’t think it is as easy to work around it as some of you would made it out to be else it does make such agreements pointless isn’t it. Okok... GEP student. You win you win. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf4786k Twincharged August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 12 hours ago, Weez911 said: The voters have been "speaking out loud" since 2011 (2015 was an anomaly due to milking of a dead man). The pap will continue to face enormous pressure every election when news or reports of "whole workplace is filled of a certain nationality" emerge. It will only get worse for them if nothing is done to fix this. I hope they continue to open the floodgate though, simply because I want them to lose in 2025. Well , if those pmet comes in and smart enoughto convert to PR, then MOM job is easier as they are considered"singaporean". So everyone have to tow the line as you will be considered xenophobic liao. And there is nothing to compliant, as its within the framework of calculation . I would strongly ask that PR is counted as FT and not cause a miscount. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playtime Twincharged August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 11 hours ago, Yewheng said: http://tklcloud.com/Feedback/feedback2.aspx?id=336 Hmm.. Tkl View.. Actually quite reasonable.. sounds like forming a justification for "strategic industry" ... 😩 but seriously.... the local IT is dead... saw it myself, one day i just realised its been a long loonnnggg time since i saw a local IT guy outside of gvot sector. entire generation decimated. in finance, we also see the ceca-lisation of the industry... but I am not in finance, so I cant be first hand sure. So, not only are we seeing professional genocide of our citizens through uncontrolled CECA invasion in the job market... the message that locals dont need Degrees while flooding the market with CECA degree holders ... some very dubious .. is a TERRIBLE betrayal of citizens future. With the IT and Finance sector in such a state... seriously what is the future for Singapore? Cannot be NTUC, Uber and GRAB sector.... the policy... at least in the implementation... is basically mortgaging our future generation. yet its been rotting for so many years, someone should hang for it. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyotaShuttle 5th Gear August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 16 hours ago, Wind30 said: The "national scared cow" is a rhetoric that singapore uses ... do you see Malaysia treat the water agreement in similar terms? USA is talking about withdrawing from Nato actually. I use the Water agreement because the consequences is extremely severe if Malaysia back out of it unilaterally but fundamentally, there is no difference as it is a contract signed by two countries. However much Singapore tries to hype it. If you want to view trade agreements context only which I think is reasonable, then ask yourself, do Singapore need free trade agreements.? If you say no, our discussion ends here I guess. We have a TOTAL of 18 FTA agreements with various countries. It is not about the impact of breaking one agreement but rather the value of our word in international negotiations. I think LKY has repeatedly said that Singapore is small but punch above its weight internationally, because people trust us. When we say something, we do it. We negotiate in good faith and we stick to it. When any of you start talking about breaking of CECA unilaterally, you should think about how much that "word" is of value, because once you do it, nobody trusts you. You said renegotiating and breaking of trade packs happens all the time. The RTS between SG and MY is about renegotiating. MY is paying us for cost and damages. Even Malaysia does not break out of a signed contract unilaterally and ask us to chase compensation in court/WTO...They follow the terms and discuss damages. Do you people know what are the damages for breaking of CECA??? or are we still talking about tearing up the CECA unilaterally and let India chase compensation. If that is the case, nobody will want to negotiate with Singapore on future trade deals or they will do the same to us. Please don't lump both of them together again. Have you have any examples of countries "with the most to lose can and often do walk away from the agreement completely while leaving the other parties with the costs and effort of chasing after the deal or seeking "compensation"? Other than USA because we are not USA... My question to you is simple, is it ok for Singapore to break of CECA unilaterally like what some MCFers are asking for? I am going to repeat myself AGAIN. It is not about renegotiating the CECA. We have renegotiated the CECA with India twice already. you keep mixing them up (bringing up RTS renegotiation) even though I have said it in my previous post I am ok with renegotiation. There is an exit clause for ceca in the agreement. Is there an exit clause in the water agreement? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fcw75 Hypersonic August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 About goddamn farking time if they are serious. https://goodyfeed.com/mom-watchlist/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=newsfeed&utm_campaign=active 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wt_know Supersonic August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 (edited) wow ... is this sengkang effect lai liao ... ? did losing 1-2 GRC move the needle? Edited August 9, 2020 by Wt_know 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fcw75 Hypersonic August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 52 minutes ago, Wt_know said: wow ... is this sengkang effect lai liao ... ? did losing 1-2 GRC move the needle? I think East Coast and West Coast 2025 will have a more dramatic effect. 4 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wind30 Turbocharged August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, ToyotaShuttle said: There is an exit clause for ceca in the agreement. Is there an exit clause in the water agreement? err... actually there was... similar to the CECA. the water agreement is subjected to review after it was signed. Edited August 9, 2020 by Wind30 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopites Supersonic August 9, 2020 Share August 9, 2020 Hahaha.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ct3833 Supersonic August 10, 2020 Author Share August 10, 2020 17 hours ago, Voodooman said: Okok... GEP student. You win you win. Not about you win or he win, if a problem can be so easily worked around, all MCFers like you and me will take the MP salaries and become MPs. Nobody here said the problem has an easy work around, who drafted, agreed and signed on the agreement ? Those who collect high salary and supposed to work for the people should go do it, not the other way round. Why try so hard to defend here ? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyotaShuttle 5th Gear August 10, 2020 Share August 10, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Wind30 said: err... actually there was... similar to the CECA. the water agreement is subjected to review after it was signed. Water agreement has a price review after 25 years. Malaysia claims it means anytime after 25 years while Singapore claims it is only available for review 25 years after signing. This is the dispute. There is no unilateral termination clause before contract expiry. CECA has a clause allowing for unilateral termination with 6 months notice. You don't see the difference? I asked about exit clause and you said there is and it is similar to CECA? Subject to review is wholy different - every contract is subject to mutual review. Edited August 10, 2020 by ToyotaShuttle 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wind30 Turbocharged August 10, 2020 Share August 10, 2020 (edited) 46 minutes ago, ToyotaShuttle said: Water agreement has a price review after 25 years. Malaysia claims it means anytime after 25 years while Singapore claims it is only available for review 25 years after signing. This is the dispute. There is no unilateral termination clause before contract expiry. CECA has a clause allowing for unilateral termination with 6 months notice. You don't see the difference. CECA has a clause for unilateral termination with 6 months notice? That is new Information to me. Do you have the source? If that is case, I am not sure what CCS is saying about renegotiating with India.. Edited August 10, 2020 by Wind30 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyotaShuttle 5th Gear August 10, 2020 Share August 10, 2020 18 minutes ago, Wind30 said: CECA has a clause for unilateral termination with 6 months notice? That is new Information to me. Do you have the source? If that is case, they I am not sure what CCS is saying about renegotiating with India.. https://investmentpolicy.unctad.org/international-investment-agreements/treaties/treaties-with-investment-provisions/3365/india-singapore-ceca Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyotaShuttle 5th Gear August 10, 2020 Share August 10, 2020 20 minutes ago, Wind30 said: CECA has a clause for unilateral termination with 6 months notice? That is new Information to me. Do you have the source? If that is case, they I am not sure what CCS is saying about renegotiating with India.. https://www.enterprisesg.gov.sg/-/media/esg/files/non-financial-assistance/for-companies/free-trade-agreements/CECA_India/Legal_Text/Chapter16_General_and_Final_Provisions 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyotaShuttle 5th Gear August 10, 2020 Share August 10, 2020 Renegotiation is different from termination. Every agreement is subject to renegotiation by mutual agreement and since this agreement has an exit clause, both parties will be willing to come to the table unless they are both seeking to end the agreement. There is nothing wrong with seeking to renegotiate the agreement from either side so CCS is not wrong. He probably means that they don't wanna give up the benefits of the agreement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ct3833 Supersonic August 10, 2020 Author Share August 10, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Wind30 said: CECA has a clause for unilateral termination with 6 months notice? That is new Information to me. Do you have the source? If that is case, I am not sure what CCS is saying about renegotiating with India.. CCS publicly announced there were enough masks during the earlier phase of covid 19 also. It os very tough for SGPrean who have to always verify if what a minister said is true or has a GOOD intention behind ....😅😅😅😅 Edited August 10, 2020 by Ct3833 ↡ Advertisement 1 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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