Carbon82 Moderator November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 By mean of fault lines, I am not referring to NSL, EWL, NEL, CCL, DTL, etc. (we are seeing less service disruption lately right?) Neither am I referring to any new geographical discovery that might put us at risk of natural disasters such as earthquake or volcano eruption, but... Majority now aware of race, religious issues, but study flags new fault lines A large majority of Singaporeans are aware of the seriousness of race and religious issues, and feel the Government has done enough to manage these divisions. But fault lines have emerged on class, immigration and lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) rights, where more Singaporeans, especially younger ones, want to see greater state involvement and public discourse. These emerging issues, if mismanaged, are also seen to affect Singaporeans' trust in the Government the most, compared with race and religion. These and other findings from a study of public opinion on fault lines in Singapore, carried out by the Institute of Policy Studies (IPS), were released yesterday. Besides Dr Mathews, the other researchers were IPS research associate Melvin Tay and research assistant Shanthini Selvarajan. Based on a survey of about 4,000 citizens and permanent residents last year, the study noted that about a third of the respondents identified race and religion as having the potential to result in violence in Singapore if not managed properly - significantly more so than class, immigration and LGBT issues. Yet only about a quarter tied race and religion to trust in the state and politicians, compared with almost 40 per cent who said trust levels in the Government would likely fall if class and immigration issues are mismanaged. Close to half of both younger and older respondents felt there should be more state involvement in immigration, reflecting possible higher levels of xenophobia and job insecurity in recent times, regardless of age, said the researchers. These results could mean that citizens now accord the Government more responsibility to do more to manage class differences and immigration issues, they added. "People may feel that the Government already has clear policies and frameworks that are fairly robust when it comes to race and religion. But perhaps for immigration, socio-economic status and LGBT issues, people might want the state to be more involved in managing those issues," said IPS senior research fellow Mathew Mathews. This is unlike in the early years after independence, when the focus was on surviving communal politics. YOUTH LESS KEEN ON MORE GOVT INTERVENTION ON RACE AND RELIGION Just over a fifth of young people aged between 18 and 25 surveyed wanted more state involvement in race issues, compared with one-third of those aged above 65. Similar results were observed for religion. This could be due to the lived experiences of the older generation, who experienced the Maria Hertogh and 1964 race riots, said researchers. The former took place in 1950, after a court decided that a child who had been raised by Muslims should be returned to her Catholic biological parents. In 1964, clashes took place between the Malays and Chinese amid rising ethnic and political tensions. For older Singaporeans, these events drove home the need for a robust state apparatus to intervene and keep the peace, added the researchers. Significantly more Malays and Indians (about 40 per cent each) wanted greater state involvement in race issues than Chinese (24 per cent) - a sign that ethnic minorities are more likely to perceive or experience discrimination than the majority. A similar trend was seen for religion. In addition, people of minority races with a university degree and above desired more state intervention than their less-educated counterparts, showing that increased education results in greater awareness of, and desire to resolve, racial and religious issues, said the study. MINORITY RACES, YOUTH MORE LIKELY TO PROBE POTENTIAL DISCRIMINATION When asked how they would respond after getting an e-mail or phone message that a business had refused to serve people from a certain race or religion, nearly half of both Malays and Indians said they were likely to investigate the issue, compared with 37 per cent of Chinese. About 30 per cent each of Malays and Indians were also more likely to take the allegation seriously by reporting it to the authorities, compared with 13 per cent of Chinese. Younger Singaporeans would also be more proactive in tracing the source of such a message, with two-thirds saying they would check with their friend who sent it, compared with only half of respondents aged 65 and above. This could be because younger people aged 18 to 25 are more sensitive and concerned about discrimination. Being digital natives, they are likely to investigate matters further, said the study. Overall, the study showed that an overwhelming 92 per cent of respondents believed the Government had done well to improve racial and religious harmony. An example of vigorous state intervention to combat social divides, it said, can be seen in the area of religion - where a range of hard and soft legislation like the Internal Security Act, Maintenance of Religious Harmony Act, and the Inter-Racial and Religious Confidence Circles has prevented potential discord and wider conflict. But while seven in 10 aged above 65 agreed that the Government is responsible for racial and religious harmony in Singapore, only half of respondents aged 18 to 25 felt this way, it added. The researchers said this shows older Singaporeans may attribute greater responsibility to the state, or believe these fault lines are most effectively managed by strong government intervention. But going forward, younger generations could prefer a more community-driven approach to race and religion. Aiyah, why waste time and $$$ to conduct such survey, just sit at neighborhood coffee shop, food court, or even surfing HWZ, MCF, etc. will get you the same results. May I add that this is a typical example of people at the top loosing touch with people on the ground... ↡ Advertisement 19 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeder Hypersonic November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 KNNCCB Ramesh... 6 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RH1667 Hypersonic November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Carbon82 said: By mean of fault lines, I am not referring to NSL, EWL, NEL, CCL, DTL, etc. (we are seeing less service disruption lately right?) Neither am I referring to any new geographical discovery that might put us at risk of natural disasters such as earthquake or volcano eruption, but... Majority now aware of race, religious issues, but study flags new fault lines A large majority of Singaporeans are aware of the seriousness of race and religious issues, and feel the Government has done enough to manage these divisions. But fault lines have emerged on class, immigration and lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) rights, where more Singaporeans, especially younger ones, want to see greater state involvement and public discourse. These emerging issues, if mismanaged, are also seen to affect Singaporeans' trust in the Government the most, compared with race and religion. These and other findings from a study of public opinion on fault lines in Singapore, carried out by the Institute of Policy Studies (IPS), were released yesterday. Besides Dr Mathews, the other researchers were IPS research associate Melvin Tay and research assistant Shanthini Selvarajan. Based on a survey of about 4,000 citizens and permanent residents last year, the study noted that about a third of the respondents identified race and religion as having the potential to result in violence in Singapore if not managed properly - significantly more so than class, immigration and LGBT issues. Yet only about a quarter tied race and religion to trust in the state and politicians, compared with almost 40 per cent who said trust levels in the Government would likely fall if class and immigration issues are mismanaged. Close to half of both younger and older respondents felt there should be more state involvement in immigration, reflecting possible higher levels of xenophobia and job insecurity in recent times, regardless of age, said the researchers. These results could mean that citizens now accord the Government more responsibility to do more to manage class differences and immigration issues, they added. "People may feel that the Government already has clear policies and frameworks that are fairly robust when it comes to race and religion. But perhaps for immigration, socio-economic status and LGBT issues, people might want the state to be more involved in managing those issues," said IPS senior research fellow Mathew Mathews. This is unlike in the early years after independence, when the focus was on surviving communal politics. YOUTH LESS KEEN ON MORE GOVT INTERVENTION ON RACE AND RELIGION Just over a fifth of young people aged between 18 and 25 surveyed wanted more state involvement in race issues, compared with one-third of those aged above 65. Similar results were observed for religion. This could be due to the lived experiences of the older generation, who experienced the Maria Hertogh and 1964 race riots, said researchers. The former took place in 1950, after a court decided that a child who had been raised by Muslims should be returned to her Catholic biological parents. In 1964, clashes took place between the Malays and Chinese amid rising ethnic and political tensions. For older Singaporeans, these events drove home the need for a robust state apparatus to intervene and keep the peace, added the researchers. Significantly more Malays and Indians (about 40 per cent each) wanted greater state involvement in race issues than Chinese (24 per cent) - a sign that ethnic minorities are more likely to perceive or experience discrimination than the majority. A similar trend was seen for religion. In addition, people of minority races with a university degree and above desired more state intervention than their less-educated counterparts, showing that increased education results in greater awareness of, and desire to resolve, racial and religious issues, said the study. MINORITY RACES, YOUTH MORE LIKELY TO PROBE POTENTIAL DISCRIMINATION When asked how they would respond after getting an e-mail or phone message that a business had refused to serve people from a certain race or religion, nearly half of both Malays and Indians said they were likely to investigate the issue, compared with 37 per cent of Chinese. About 30 per cent each of Malays and Indians were also more likely to take the allegation seriously by reporting it to the authorities, compared with 13 per cent of Chinese. Younger Singaporeans would also be more proactive in tracing the source of such a message, with two-thirds saying they would check with their friend who sent it, compared with only half of respondents aged 65 and above. This could be because younger people aged 18 to 25 are more sensitive and concerned about discrimination. Being digital natives, they are likely to investigate matters further, said the study. Overall, the study showed that an overwhelming 92 per cent of respondents believed the Government had done well to improve racial and religious harmony. An example of vigorous state intervention to combat social divides, it said, can be seen in the area of religion - where a range of hard and soft legislation like the Internal Security Act, Maintenance of Religious Harmony Act, and the Inter-Racial and Religious Confidence Circles has prevented potential discord and wider conflict. But while seven in 10 aged above 65 agreed that the Government is responsible for racial and religious harmony in Singapore, only half of respondents aged 18 to 25 felt this way, it added. The researchers said this shows older Singaporeans may attribute greater responsibility to the state, or believe these fault lines are most effectively managed by strong government intervention. But going forward, younger generations could prefer a more community-driven approach to race and religion. Aiyah, why waste time and $$$ to conduct such survey, just sit at neighborhood coffee shop, food court, or even surfing HWZ, MCF, etc. will get you the same results. May I add that this is a typical example of people at the top loosing touch with people on the ground... When they surrounded by yes men and people who just want to look good in front of their master, they will only get to hear “ good things “. 4 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
inlinesix Hypersonic November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 55 minutes ago, RH1667 said: When they surrounded by yes men and people who just want to look good in front of their master, they will only get to hear “ good things “. Do you dare to tell your boss the bad news? 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vratenza Supersonic November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Carbon82 said: Significantly more Malays and Indians (about 40 per cent each) wanted greater state involvement in race issues than Chinese (24 per cent) - a sign that ethnic minorities are more likely to perceive or experience discrimination than the majority. A similar trend was seen for religion. Oh reaaaaalliiiiiiiiiii? 😁 Edited November 1, 2019 by Vratenza 2 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freeder Hypersonic November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 5 hours ago, Carbon82 said: By mean of fault lines, I am not referring to NSL, EWL, NEL, CCL, DTL, etc. (we are seeing less service disruption lately right?) Neither am I referring to any new geographical discovery that might put us at risk of natural disasters such as earthquake or volcano eruption, but... Majority now aware of race, religious issues, but study flags new fault lines A large majority of Singaporeans are aware of the seriousness of race and religious issues, and feel the Government has done enough to manage these divisions. But fault lines have emerged on class, immigration and lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) rights, where more Singaporeans, especially younger ones, want to see greater state involvement and public discourse. These emerging issues, if mismanaged, are also seen to affect Singaporeans' trust in the Government the most, compared with race and religion. These and other findings from a study of public opinion on fault lines in Singapore, carried out by the Institute of Policy Studies (IPS), were released yesterday. Besides Dr Mathews, the other researchers were IPS research associate Melvin Tay and research assistant Shanthini Selvarajan. Based on a survey of about 4,000 citizens and permanent residents last year, the study noted that about a third of the respondents identified race and religion as having the potential to result in violence in Singapore if not managed properly - significantly more so than class, immigration and LGBT issues. Yet only about a quarter tied race and religion to trust in the state and politicians, compared with almost 40 per cent who said trust levels in the Government would likely fall if class and immigration issues are mismanaged. Close to half of both younger and older respondents felt there should be more state involvement in immigration, reflecting possible higher levels of xenophobia and job insecurity in recent times, regardless of age, said the researchers. These results could mean that citizens now accord the Government more responsibility to do more to manage class differences and immigration issues, they added. "People may feel that the Government already has clear policies and frameworks that are fairly robust when it comes to race and religion. But perhaps for immigration, socio-economic status and LGBT issues, people might want the state to be more involved in managing those issues," said IPS senior research fellow Mathew Mathews. This is unlike in the early years after independence, when the focus was on surviving communal politics. YOUTH LESS KEEN ON MORE GOVT INTERVENTION ON RACE AND RELIGION Just over a fifth of young people aged between 18 and 25 surveyed wanted more state involvement in race issues, compared with one-third of those aged above 65. Similar results were observed for religion. This could be due to the lived experiences of the older generation, who experienced the Maria Hertogh and 1964 race riots, said researchers. The former took place in 1950, after a court decided that a child who had been raised by Muslims should be returned to her Catholic biological parents. In 1964, clashes took place between the Malays and Chinese amid rising ethnic and political tensions. For older Singaporeans, these events drove home the need for a robust state apparatus to intervene and keep the peace, added the researchers. Significantly more Malays and Indians (about 40 per cent each) wanted greater state involvement in race issues than Chinese (24 per cent) - a sign that ethnic minorities are more likely to perceive or experience discrimination than the majority. A similar trend was seen for religion. In addition, people of minority races with a university degree and above desired more state intervention than their less-educated counterparts, showing that increased education results in greater awareness of, and desire to resolve, racial and religious issues, said the study. MINORITY RACES, YOUTH MORE LIKELY TO PROBE POTENTIAL DISCRIMINATION When asked how they would respond after getting an e-mail or phone message that a business had refused to serve people from a certain race or religion, nearly half of both Malays and Indians said they were likely to investigate the issue, compared with 37 per cent of Chinese. About 30 per cent each of Malays and Indians were also more likely to take the allegation seriously by reporting it to the authorities, compared with 13 per cent of Chinese. Younger Singaporeans would also be more proactive in tracing the source of such a message, with two-thirds saying they would check with their friend who sent it, compared with only half of respondents aged 65 and above. This could be because younger people aged 18 to 25 are more sensitive and concerned about discrimination. Being digital natives, they are likely to investigate matters further, said the study. Overall, the study showed that an overwhelming 92 per cent of respondents believed the Government had done well to improve racial and religious harmony. An example of vigorous state intervention to combat social divides, it said, can be seen in the area of religion - where a range of hard and soft legislation like the Internal Security Act, Maintenance of Religious Harmony Act, and the Inter-Racial and Religious Confidence Circles has prevented potential discord and wider conflict. But while seven in 10 aged above 65 agreed that the Government is responsible for racial and religious harmony in Singapore, only half of respondents aged 18 to 25 felt this way, it added. The researchers said this shows older Singaporeans may attribute greater responsibility to the state, or believe these fault lines are most effectively managed by strong government intervention. But going forward, younger generations could prefer a more community-driven approach to race and religion. Aiyah, why waste time and $$$ to conduct such survey, just sit at neighborhood coffee shop, food court, or even surfing HWZ, MCF, etc. will get you the same results. May I add that this is a typical example of people at the top loosing touch with people on the ground... Pls fwd this article to CECA Heng.. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf4786k Twincharged November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 10 hours ago, Davidtch said: Do you dare to tell your boss the bad news? Many people either choose to be like or to be fear but lack the importance to be respected. And thats where it matters most. Continue to play the emperor new clothes and ignore all warning of risk/impairment. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor68 Turbocharged November 1, 2019 Share November 1, 2019 11 hours ago, Davidtch said: Do you dare to tell your boss the bad news? I will sack you if you tell me a false new just to make me happy for a couple of minutes. I would prefer the factual news even if it is 'bad' but do also offer solutions. Bad news will eventually reached me, so i need not need you to tell me and pay you. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash2017 Twincharged November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 14 hours ago, Carbon82 said: By mean of fault lines, I am not referring to NSL, EWL, NEL, CCL, DTL, etc. (we are seeing less service disruption lately right?) Neither am I referring to any new geographical discovery that might put us at risk of natural disasters such as earthquake or volcano eruption, but... Majority now aware of race, religious issues, but study flags new fault lines A large majority of Singaporeans are aware of the seriousness of race and religious issues, and feel the Government has done enough to manage these divisions. But fault lines have emerged on class, immigration and lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) rights, where more Singaporeans, especially younger ones, want to see greater state involvement and public discourse. These emerging issues, if mismanaged, are also seen to affect Singaporeans' trust in the Government the most, compared with race and religion. These and other findings from a study of public opinion on fault lines in Singapore, carried out by the Institute of Policy Studies (IPS), were released yesterday. Besides Dr Mathews, the other researchers were IPS research associate Melvin Tay and research assistant Shanthini Selvarajan. Based on a survey of about 4,000 citizens and permanent residents last year, the study noted that about a third of the respondents identified race and religion as having the potential to result in violence in Singapore if not managed properly - significantly more so than class, immigration and LGBT issues. Yet only about a quarter tied race and religion to trust in the state and politicians, compared with almost 40 per cent who said trust levels in the Government would likely fall if class and immigration issues are mismanaged. Close to half of both younger and older respondents felt there should be more state involvement in immigration, reflecting possible higher levels of xenophobia and job insecurity in recent times, regardless of age, said the researchers. These results could mean that citizens now accord the Government more responsibility to do more to manage class differences and immigration issues, they added. "People may feel that the Government already has clear policies and frameworks that are fairly robust when it comes to race and religion. But perhaps for immigration, socio-economic status and LGBT issues, people might want the state to be more involved in managing those issues," said IPS senior research fellow Mathew Mathews. This is unlike in the early years after independence, when the focus was on surviving communal politics. YOUTH LESS KEEN ON MORE GOVT INTERVENTION ON RACE AND RELIGION Just over a fifth of young people aged between 18 and 25 surveyed wanted more state involvement in race issues, compared with one-third of those aged above 65. Similar results were observed for religion. This could be due to the lived experiences of the older generation, who experienced the Maria Hertogh and 1964 race riots, said researchers. The former took place in 1950, after a court decided that a child who had been raised by Muslims should be returned to her Catholic biological parents. In 1964, clashes took place between the Malays and Chinese amid rising ethnic and political tensions. For older Singaporeans, these events drove home the need for a robust state apparatus to intervene and keep the peace, added the researchers. Significantly more Malays and Indians (about 40 per cent each) wanted greater state involvement in race issues than Chinese (24 per cent) - a sign that ethnic minorities are more likely to perceive or experience discrimination than the majority. A similar trend was seen for religion. In addition, people of minority races with a university degree and above desired more state intervention than their less-educated counterparts, showing that increased education results in greater awareness of, and desire to resolve, racial and religious issues, said the study. MINORITY RACES, YOUTH MORE LIKELY TO PROBE POTENTIAL DISCRIMINATION When asked how they would respond after getting an e-mail or phone message that a business had refused to serve people from a certain race or religion, nearly half of both Malays and Indians said they were likely to investigate the issue, compared with 37 per cent of Chinese. About 30 per cent each of Malays and Indians were also more likely to take the allegation seriously by reporting it to the authorities, compared with 13 per cent of Chinese. Younger Singaporeans would also be more proactive in tracing the source of such a message, with two-thirds saying they would check with their friend who sent it, compared with only half of respondents aged 65 and above. This could be because younger people aged 18 to 25 are more sensitive and concerned about discrimination. Being digital natives, they are likely to investigate matters further, said the study. Overall, the study showed that an overwhelming 92 per cent of respondents believed the Government had done well to improve racial and religious harmony. An example of vigorous state intervention to combat social divides, it said, can be seen in the area of religion - where a range of hard and soft legislation like the Internal Security Act, Maintenance of Religious Harmony Act, and the Inter-Racial and Religious Confidence Circles has prevented potential discord and wider conflict. But while seven in 10 aged above 65 agreed that the Government is responsible for racial and religious harmony in Singapore, only half of respondents aged 18 to 25 felt this way, it added. The researchers said this shows older Singaporeans may attribute greater responsibility to the state, or believe these fault lines are most effectively managed by strong government intervention. But going forward, younger generations could prefer a more community-driven approach to race and religion. Aiyah, why waste time and $$$ to conduct such survey, just sit at neighborhood coffee shop, food court, or even surfing HWZ, MCF, etc. will get you the same results. May I add that this is a typical example of people at the top loosing touch with people on the ground... the world does not stand still morality changes with time social values changes with time if a sacred promise to the people that their own money can be withdrawn at the age of 55 years then broken, then what examples are we setting for the society. we are suppose to uphold our Asian values but our ex-Malaysian minister suggest that we send our old folks to old age home in Malaysia. he also if we cant afford treatment in our own country go to our neighbor's clinic or hospital for cheaper treatment cant blame the society for being confused, we have laws 377A but they say for the time being they would not enforce. then why have the law in the first place. those affected constantly live in fear in parliament where serious discussions are carried out where Singaporeans lives are at stake, we have an ex-PM that replied, He is NOT my brother. Don't we have laws to follow. people takes time to learn and adapt, we import foreigners and give out citizenship like giving out free tissues. you see one foreigner admitted, they entire clan comes into Singapore. NOT now may be don't the road they will start to exhaust our resources (eg healthcare). who carries the burden of protecting everyone in Singapore regardless of citizens or not, is our local man, 2 years NS and ten plus years reservists, most new citizens don't do NS. the funny thing is some members of parliament including ministers (not the old old ones) did not do NS and are controlling how we eat, shxt and sleep. Doing NS is the writ of passage to being a Singaporean male. we say we are neutral to the two superpowers but then when we go to one of the superpower's place and tell nasty face losing jokes about the other superpower. how to define being neutral we restrict Thaipusam street celebration and music sound level which had been a tradition for donkey years and yet we opening close road for St Patrick's Day and celebrate Songkran in CC. in my humble opinion, it requires everyone's effort to stay united and it takes two hands to create the divisions 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phluvcat 6th Gear November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 11 hours ago, Davidtch said: Do you dare to tell your boss the bad news? I do that but kanna perceived as being negative. Ok lor, I keep quiet. Working culture getting worse, all wanna hear 95FM. Problems? Just kick the can down the road, now more important is achieve results, opening ra ra and stuff like that... Wtf. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash2017 Twincharged November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 we are living in troubled times with plenty of uncertainty I want to share with the younger ones here be quick to learn to be financially independent and NOT be enslave to be financially dependent start with: your goal is NOT to look rich BUT to be really rich eg have you ever wondered why the poorly dressed undertaker become so rich and haolian? or take me for example how do you think I got my stars on my shoulder which comes with handsome remunerations if you agree please support, kee chiu 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
inlinesix Hypersonic November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 2 hours ago, Victor68 said: I will sack you if you tell me a false new just to make me happy for a couple of minutes. I would prefer the factual news even if it is 'bad' but do also offer solutions. Bad news will eventually reached me, so i need not need you to tell me and pay you. Pls refer to other response to my queries. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamburger Hypersonic November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 GE is indeed round the corner. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phluvcat 6th Gear November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 While waiting for installation of new solar film for my front windows... I saw this building... 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playtime Twincharged November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 they avoided mentioning the fault between govt and people.... pointless survey if it avoids a major faultline. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesc Hypersonic November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 14 hours ago, Vratenza said: Oh reaaaaalliiiiiiiiiii? 😁 I have a Chinese colleague who is a bit tanned because he is an outdoor kind of guy and when we go for snacks at a Malay stall we always get him to order because he always get more and pays less. 2 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesc Hypersonic November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 I hope people can love lesbians more and I personally would love to see more social intercourse about loving lesbians. Please don't hate us because we are different. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesc Hypersonic November 2, 2019 Share November 2, 2019 Because I am a lesbian and different I never ask people to follow my lifestyle. If a man likes other men I never say its wrong and they should turn lesbian and go after ladies like me. I don't think its wrong to be gay and more men don't like women and turn gay then it just means more ladies for lesbians like me. ↡ Advertisement 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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