Malaysian students in S'pore

[Xanavi]

Thatz different.

 

NS mah. Any idiot would play by the rules. You ask them to sit. They sit. You ask them to jump they jump.

 

The difference is last time I can ask my recruits to keep jumping until I say they can stop.

 

Now is they ask you jump how many times.

 

Calibre totally different. LAST TIME.

 

Now all young Singaporeans or Malaysians same la.

On the contary, they are not the obedient type that many people would prefer. Rather "rebellious "in sone people's term. The characteristics which I observed is that they like to questions alot. Jot the authority, but the rationale behind the instructions. The will think of ways to improvise ( which alot of senior will think they chao keng). But to me it isnt so. A little more open mind will realise that they are growing and learning and contributing new and better ideas. Although sometimes childish in thinking which i think are inevitable, and that is where older, more experience seniors got to teach and advise them.

[Jamesc]

Interesting. The parents mentioned are either Indian or Chinese.

 

Parents would do whatever it takes to give their children a leg up. I wouldn't want my child "educated" in Malaysia either, frankly.

 

My friend Najib says if these people are not happy they can leave.

 

I totally disagree with him as these people also built up the country

 

and the country would be much less advanced without them.

 

[Voodooman]

Then of course, meritocracy takes place in employment. Nationality takes a lower priority.

Maybe we should open SAF and our politics to foreigners based on meritocracy as well, I am sure they would cost less but not sure if our interest will be aligned as well.

 

P.S. I am not against immigration but that is quite a sweeping statement.

Edited October 4, 2015 by Voodooman

[Watwheels]

I believe it's a choice they make. Nobody force them to send their kids to schools in Singapore.

 

They themselves get to enjoy plenty of subsidies from their own govt be it education, medical, fuel, basic necessities and etc. If they choose Singapore education over M'sia's...like I said it's their choice. If they want to hiam tuition fees are too ex here there are always other options. It's not the end(education) for their children.

[TVT]

 

Then of course, meritocracy takes place in employment. Nationality takes a lower priority.

But not all jobs can be meritocracy over nationality. Some jobs have security at sake, hence only locals can be employed. Eg, national defense, homeland security, and even taxi driving....

[Xanavi]

But not all jobs can be meritocracy over nationality. Some jobs have security at sake, hence only locals can be employed. Eg, national defense, homeland security, and even taxi driving....

Ok, I've never explained myself properly. When I meant Meritocracy over nationality, I meant not chosing Malaysian over other foreigners just for preference sake. Apologies for theisunderstanding caused. Of course jobs in government sector (esp defence and security jobs) must be purely for citizens only.

[inlinesix]

Ok, I've never explained myself properly. When I meant Meritocracy over nationality, I meant not chosing Malaysian over other foreigners just for preference sake. Apologies for theisunderstanding caused. Of course jobs in government sector (esp defence and security jobs) must be purely for citizens only.

 

Gurkha how?

[Watwheels]

Ok, I've never explained myself properly. When I meant Meritocracy over nationality, I meant not chosing Malaysian over other foreigners just for preference sake. Apologies for theisunderstanding caused. Of course jobs in government sector (esp defence and security jobs) must be purely for citizens only.

 

Mr KBW is born and bred in Penang.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaw_Boon_Wan

 

Ms Lee Bee Wah is born and bred in Johor.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Bee_Wah

 

You were saying?

[Tohto]

Maybe yes, maybe not.

With the long distance travelling to and fro between Malaysia and Singapore, I don't think even if fee remain unchange for Malaysian students, the intake will increase.

 

But yes, you all have a point.

Although my take is that I'll always have a higher acceptance level or biase towards Malaysians compared to other foreigners. Just because I felt we were too close to be discriminated. Just like I feel closer to my direct neighbours than a fellow Singaporean from Jurong (cause I lived in the east).

Then of course, meritocracy takes place in employment. Nationality takes a lower priority.

Just curious, are you a Malaysian turn sjngaporean.

 

It just don't make sense to have a singaporean tax payer money to subsidize a foreign students. Even from Malaysia.

[Xanavi]

 

Gurkha how?

Bro, that one long history lah. They are more likely willing to sacrifice their lives for missions than most of us leh.

[Happily1986]

I'm not disagreeing.

Maybe the impression i had towards a lot of malaysians (whom I worked for, worked with me, worked for me, friends) are the positive ones.

 

I'm not assuming... neither am I stereotyping. Like how people generally stereotype PRCs.

 

(Side note to mod, can don't limit the time to praise a person ? )

 

the hard truth is that soft feelings or sentiments have no place in policy making. This move to revise school fees wasn't targeting Malaysians in particular. A greater differentiation between the Singaporean core and the erstwhile non localized mantle had to be made. if you benefited from the system, you have a moral obligation to give back.

 

The way i see it, there are no obligations in place for the students or their families to give back as compared to the locals/PRs so it is only fair that they pay more for what they are getting now.

 

From another perspective, it is also about product differentiation. Who would bother to sink their roots locally if the incentives for doing so aren't that significant? People who have taken the step to make this place their home, it is only right that they get some degree of differentiation here.

 

If you can get every bell and whistle on the E class that came standard with the S class, it makes lesser sense to get a S class. At least a sizeable amount of people will choose to opt for the E class.

 

[Xanavi]

Just curious, are you a Malaysian turn sjngaporean.

 

It just don't make sense to have a singaporean tax payer money to subsidize a foreign students. Even from Malaysia.

No, I'm a thorough bred Singaporean. That's why I said, your statement makes perfect sense. But I'll be more willing to make allowances for Malaysians for the reasons I've mentioned earlier.

[Little_prince]

you have no idea how many foreigners are in our govt sector and stat boards

 

the numbers will astound you.

 

one example is the ah neh bu with the fake mba from IDA. she's still there. one of many many

 

 

Ok, I've never explained myself properly. When I meant Meritocracy over nationality, I meant not chosing Malaysian over other foreigners just for preference sake. Apologies for theisunderstanding caused. Of course jobs in government sector (esp defence and security jobs) must be purely for citizens only.

 

[Voodooman]

 

Mr KBW is born and bred in Penang.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khaw_Boon_Wan

 

Ms Lee Bee Wah is born and bred in Johor.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Bee_Wah

 

You were saying?

I am sure they are Singaporeans now. We welcome all who join us and sink their roots here.

[Happily1986]

Ok, I've never explained myself properly. When I meant Meritocracy over nationality, I meant not chosing Malaysian over other foreigners just for preference sake. Apologies for theisunderstanding caused. Of course jobs in government sector (esp defence and security jobs) must be purely for citizens only.

 

Education my friend is means for social mobility. It is a ticket that permits many an individual to escape the shackles of poverty. it is the state's obligation to ensure that everyone gets a fair shot at that.

 

So my question to you is, to whom does the state owe her obligation to?

 

When i was in primary school, i often ponder upon the saying on the school wall. No one owes you a living. That, is the central precept underlying our anti welfare state concept of governance.

 

If the state do not owe her citizens that much, why should she have towards Malaysians for the matter?

 

And i dare say, for all the things you said that Malaysians are the most similar to us in terms of ethos, culture and ways of living, they are also the one most inclined to reside long term here in Singapore without relinquishing their birthright citizenship.

Edited October 4, 2015 by Happily1986

[Xanavi]

you have no idea how many foreigners are in our govt sector and stat boards

 

the numbers will astound you.

 

one example is the ah neh bu with the fake mba from IDA. she's still there. one of many many

 

 

 

Yes I am astound. The foreigners employment issue in Government sector and statutory boards is something I've can't fathom either.

[Voodooman]

Thatz different.

 

NS mah. Any idiot would play by the rules. You ask them to sit. They sit. You ask them to jump they jump.

 

The difference is last time I can ask my recruits to keep jumping until I say they can stop.

 

Now is they ask you jump how many times.

 

Calibre totally different. LAST TIME.

 

Now all young Singaporeans or Malaysians same la.

Last time, people have less choice and options, so bo bian. Now can complain Mindef and MP. hahaha...

 

GE2015 has proven that Singaporeans are extremely practical and pragmatic (you give me what I want and I give you my vote). Our parents and grand parents probably think the rot started 30 years ago. The problem with F&B job is the relatively low pay and possibly lack of career advancement. But for the Pinoy and Viet, the package offered here is so much better than what is available back home. Their dreams start the minute they get home. Young Singaporeans who works in F&B have little dreams (sorry, that is a sweeping statement but I don't know how to put it in a politically correct manner).

 

I have little problem motivating my staff due to a high performance culture (they work weekends and public holidays, if necessary) but I have a recurring problem getting my domestic helper to give her best in her work especially when noone is around to supervise her (despite being paid above market). When you are working in a dead end job (the good ones would have moved on or are just there to learn the trade for a limited period), it is kind of hard to feel motivated, so other goodies must be beefed up (but Singaporeans are so practical non monetary candies can only work so long). In a nutshell, we are no longer the gong gong straight straight people of yesterdays. And that is the same reason why many repetitive and low productivity jobs have to be mechanised.

 

F&B needs to pay more $ and benefits to attract good locals, like in Australia or USA, but knowing how squeezed our SME are, this problem will persist. So we have to continue to rely on foreigners. It is circular, can really forgot about hiring locals.

 

Thoughts?

Edited October 4, 2015 by Voodooman

[Icedbs]

And i dare say, for all the things you said that Malaysians are the most similar to us in terms of ethos, culture and ways of living, they are also the one most inclined to reside long term here in Singapore without relinquishing their birthright citizenship.

 

By their own, perhaps you are right that they are most inclined to reside long term without relinquishing their citizenship.

 

But I guess the reason why they are provided an education in SGP since young is because they are also the group that most willing to settle here long term, marrying Sporeans, and starting a family here. Reasons due to similar culture, language and proximity. After starting a family they are inclined to convert to Sporean.

 

I have many Uni Malaysian friends who are Sporeans today. Main driving motivation is that they married Sporean, had kids, and for the kids sake, they converted themselves.

 

If 3-4 Msians out of 10 who come here willing to convert, that would have help to boost the local talent pool and the low birth rate that we have. BTW, not everyone can be converted. Only those deemed to be "talent" (at least graduate from Spore Unis or being PR for a darn long time)

 

And finally, unlike other foreigners, Malaysians cannot just withdraw their cpf anytime they like when they feel like going home. They have to wait until 55, so that sort of prolong their stay here and hopefully, start a family here and convert.

 

It all boils back down to the fact that being a small country, we need talents to survive and if we don't produce enough, we just need to get it from our neighbor who has the least issue in integrating into our society.

Edited October 4, 2015 by Icedbs