2015 Forester 2.0

[Axela72]

haha, you don't even know me in real life. What you have seen here is just face value. but that is human nature. I can understand that. I will treat it as a 2 cents comment as there is no gain for me to proof on whether your belief is correct or not. If I am irrational, I wouldn't not be able to qualify/sustain in my current career for decades as a six sigma black belt.

 

I remember someone ever mentioned that I wont get a Forester before. In the end, someone is wrong as I am not predictable.

 

Bro, you are the last person to know what is rational and what is irrational.

 

Your journey of choosing your ride is every bit contrary to the idea of rationality.

 

Edited December 4, 2015 by Axela72

[Ngbernie]

why is this turning out to be a "my ride is better than yours" thread?

 

NA or TC, we only use the car for 10 years tops. 95% of Subaru vehicles built in the last 10 years are still on the road, so you are worrying excessively.

 

bro axela, you've already made your decision, just look forward to your ride, don't need to keep justifying to yourself (and everyone else) that you made the right choice. there are no right choices, because everyone have different valuation of things. if there is only 1 correct answer, we will only see one car model on the road - all the rest are "wrong"

 

about bhp, more is not always better. Your fellow road users may not share your superhuman reflexes and your fast-accelerating/quick-braking/sharp-turning zao chia just stresses other drivers more. 

 

Just like how some people bros like E-cups F-cups, the bigger (bhp) the better!! Perosnally C-cup is enough for me. 

since everyone has differing tastes, to each his own. As long as we like girls (and cars), we are on the same page!   

[Pioneer]

I am not going to argue whether you are rational or irrational. It is true I do not know you.

 

I have seen stupid people who have PhDs or Master, rich businessman who get cheated. 

 

Having a six sigma black belt only says you are good only in the narrow spectrum of performance. Anyone, with enough experience, practice and average intelligence can be expert in one narrow area of expertise.

 

So ya, have XXX or YYY does not mean you are therefore incapable of being irrational.

 

 

Haha.. I can only predict rationality not irrationality so ya, I was wrong about you not getting a forester, bro.

 

haha, you don't even know me in real life. What you have seen here is just face value. but that is human nature. I can understand that. I will treat it as a 2 cents comment as there is no gain for me to proof on whether your belief is correct or not. If I am irrational, I wouldn't not be able to qualify/sustain in my current career for decades as a six sigma black belt.

 

I remember someone ever mentioned that I wont get a Forester before. In the end, someone is wrong as I am not predictable.

 

[Pioneer]

Haha but but what if Altis is AA-cup, Forester NA is A-Cup and only FXT is a B+ cup?

 

More is better in terms of bhp. You don't have to use it but when you need it, you have it.

 

Ask yourself, how often does an owner of a MPV drives 7 people? Maybe once a week, a month or a few months? But you aint going to hear them say that they don't need the extra 2 seats. 

 

 

 

 

 

why is this turning out to be a "my ride is better than yours" thread?

 

NA or TC, we only use the car for 10 years tops. 95% of Subaru vehicles built in the last 10 years are still on the road, so you are worrying excessively.

 

bro axela, you've already made your decision, just look forward to your ride, don't need to keep justifying to yourself (and everyone else) that you made the right choice. there are no right choices, because everyone have different valuation of things. if there is only 1 correct answer, we will only see one car model on the road - all the rest are "wrong"

 

about bhp, more is not always better. Your fellow road users may not share your superhuman reflexes and your fast-accelerating/quick-braking/sharp-turning zao chia just stresses other drivers more. 

 

Just like how some people bros like E-cups F-cups, the bigger (bhp) the better!! Perosnally C-cup is enough for me. 

since everyone has differing tastes, to each his own. As long as we like girls (and cars), we are on the same page!   

 

[Axela72]

like I said, this is human nature. since I am also human, sometime, I do made irrational judgement too.

 

Is not easy to shift one's Paradigm. Typically those can manage to achieve that are those that are very successful in their real life

 

 

I am not going to argue whether you are rational or irrational. It is true I do not know you.

 

I have seen stupid people who have PhDs or Master, rich businessman who get cheated. 

 

Having a six sigma black belt only says you are good only in the narrow spectrum of performance. Anyone, with enough experience, practice and average intelligence can be expert in one narrow area of expertise.

 

So ya, have XXX or YYY does not mean you are therefore incapable of being irrational.

 

 

Haha.. I can only predict rationality not irrationality so ya, I was wrong about you not getting a forester, bro.

 

[macrosszero]

No idea. If XT is that worthy than the N.A. counterpart, why would more than 50% in the Forester.org vote for the N.A. vs the XT, even though most of vocal member are XT owner?

 

Not to mention that their list price difference over there is not more than 3k. Ours price is higher over here for XT is due to the 5k penalty on Cevs. Probably the mass market still prefer reliability, cheaper to maintain than power. Just like over in sg, why many ppls still prefer made in Thailand vs those made in Japan even though at the bottom of our heart, we know that made in Japan is better

 

Let's rationally work through your argument, because you aren't comparing apples to apples when you cite Forester.org's poll on owner preference. I am working based on North American prices listed on Subaru.com - your mileage may vary, but not significantly I suspect.

 

In the North American Market, the base Forester is a 2.5i, not a 2.0i we get here. Thus the motor outputs 170hp and 235nM torque. To refresh our memory, the Singapore 2.0i puts out 148hp and 198nM torque. In the US market, their 2.0XT puts out 250hp and 350nM torque, and our 2.0XT puts out 237hp and 350nM torque. In talking deltas in the same market, here are the rational, numbers-backed facts:

 

- In Singapore, for an additional 8% outlay, you get 89hp and 152nM more.

 

-In the US (comparing the cheapest 2.5i and cheapest 2.0XT), the premium is 31%, for that you net 80hp and 115nM. Is it any wonder why people don't find this a fair value proposition? Take note that across the trims, the horsepower and torque ratings don't change; only the trims and options.

 

-Even if we take the same "Premium" trim on a 2.5i and a 2.0XT, the price delta is an 18% premium. That is an apples-to-apples comparison. 

 

-It is only when we compare the "Touring" trim, that the price gap starts getting similar to the Singapore situation - 9%. BUT! You're still getting a 2.5 litre motor that is closer in performance to the 2.0 turbocharged motor than the asthmatic 2.0i mill that we get in the Singapore car! 

 

As someone else said, its perfectly ok to justify your choice of purchase by saying you don't need the power or you value the fuel economy, but to suggest a poll conducted by an internet forum in another country, with a car that has a different engine, supports your line of argument? I'm only too glad to call you out on that.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Macrosszero

[majere_r]

 

Example, if refer to the various owner review from sgcarmart, most are commenting on XT but not the N.A. I can afford to pay for the XT but, can't accept the FC and the extra care need to take care for Turbo engine. Wonder did I made the right choice to get the N.A. instead of XT

 

Hmmm... if one can afford or want to drive FXT, they shouldn't worry about the FC in the first place. 

 

It's like someone who got a Cayenne or X5 and then complaint about the FC and the maintenance costs.... 

 

Just get the car that best meets your needs... 

Edited December 4, 2015 by majere_r

[Detach8]

You crazy fxxxkers, just buy the car you like it and drive it. What's there to compare? You want to share knowledge then come and share.

 

Look up a classic theead in the bmw-sg forum where one egoistic low self esteem member basically requested to exchange singpass to see how many properties he have just because someone casually said he was being cheap. Do we really need to go to that extent? Are Singaporeans too obsessed with comparison and competition?

[Axela72]

Yap, you caught me . I was waiting for someone to point me out that the vote might be subjective because over there, it is 2.5L vs XT, after I made that comment.

 

But we are also not 100% sure that all those voted for N.A are surely from 2.5L because the voter can be also came from other countries with 2.0L N.A. as well. maybe minority, I am not sure until proven (see the raw data).

 

 I did not mention that N.A. is better than Turbo. or maybe I mislead my post without knowing.

 

Let's rationally work through your argument, because you aren't comparing apples to apples when you cite Forester.org's poll on owner preference. I am working based on North American prices listed on Subaru.com - your mileage may vary, but not significantly I suspect.

 

In the North American Market, the base Forester is a 2.5i, not a 2.0i we get here. Thus the motor outputs 170hp and 235nM torque. To refresh our memory, the Singapore 2.0i puts out 148hp and 198nM torque. In the US market, their 2.0XT puts out 250hp and 350nM torque, and our 2.0XT puts out 237hp and 350nM torque. In talking deltas in the same market, here are the rational, numbers-backed facts:

 

- In Singapore, for an additional 8% outlay, you get 89hp and 152nM more.

 

-In the US (comparing the cheapest 2.5i and cheapest 2.0XT), the premium is 31%, for that you net 80hp and 115nM. Is it any wonder why people don't find this a fair value proposition? Take note that across the trims, the horsepower and torque ratings don't change; only the trims and options.

 

-Even if we take the same "Premium" trim on a 2.5i and a 2.0XT, the price delta is an 18% premium. That is an apples-to-apples comparison. 

 

-It is only when we compare the "Touring" trim, that the price gap starts getting similar to the Singapore situation - 9%. BUT! You're still getting a 2.5 litre motor that is closer in performance to the 2.0 turbocharged motor than the asthmatic 2.0i mill that we get in the Singapore car! 

 

As someone else said, its perfectly ok to justify your choice of purchase by saying you don't need the power or you value the fuel economy, but to suggest a poll conducted by an internet forum in another country, with a car that has a different engine, supports your line of argument? I'm only too glad to call you out on that.

 

[macrosszero]

But we are also not 100% sure that all those voted for N.A are surely from 2.5L because the voter can be also came from other countries with 2.0L N.A. as well. maybe minority, I am not sure until proven (see the raw data).

 

A few hours ago, you pointed to that poll to back up your position, and now you are discrediting said poll because it was proven that it was not a fair comparison? You're more slippery than I thought!

[Pioneer]

Haha... That is so funny if it is true.

 

You crazy fxxxkers, just buy the car you like it and drive it. What's there to compare? You want to share knowledge then come and share.

Look up a classic theead in the bmw-sg forum where one egoistic low self esteem member basically requested to exchange singpass to see how many properties he have just because someone casually said he was being cheap. Do we really need to go to that extent? Are Singaporeans too obsessed with comparison and competition?

 

How dare you question the 10 yr+++ six sigma black belt?   

 

A few hours ago, you pointed to that poll to back up your position, and now you are discrediting said poll because it was proven that it was not a fair comparison? You're more slippery than I thought!

 

[Axela72]

probably he is not aware that if there are variances, we may test the hypothesis by assigning it as constant.

 

How dare you question the 10 yr+++ six sigma black belt?   

 

[Tohto]

Guys, don't need to waste your time with him lah.

[majere_r]

Haha... That is so funny if it is true.

 

 

How dare you question the 10 yr+++ six sigma black belt?   

 

Decades leh... can mean more than 20 years... go the black belt in early 20s or teens? High achiever leh...

[Fireheart71]

Hi Foresters,

 

Letting go extra brand new 2.0 strut bar (NA) 

& cargo rear bumper protector stainless steel (common) both to let go.

 

PM me your contact for pictures and pricing.

 

Thanks

Edited December 4, 2015 by Fireheart71

[Redsurfer777]

Wa. No ending to this.

Views are subjective.

Ultimately you are the one to decide and u are the one to use it everyday.

 

Arguments like this will not get anywhere. It's like asking which is a better phone, samsung or apple or xiao mi or oneplus or sony or lg or google.

There is no answer actually.

 

Its also like asking which stall food taste better. For a certain stall, you feel it taste like shit, but well other people dun and are still queing for it.

 

There is no rational. The only rational is u like it, u use it and be happy with it.

Edited December 4, 2015 by Redsurfer777

[azaouogh]

I can't stop admiring my neighbour's new white forester. I think it looks better than vezel!

[Palmer]

Guys, I think bro Axela72 is right. NA is better than TC. Period.

 

I gotta sell my brand new FXT and downgrade to a NA. Six Sigma Black Belt can't be wrong. (People already put credentials already, must give face lah)

 

Cheers :)