PIC claim through 3rd party agents

[oleandero]

i am damn sick of hearing people telling me about all these 3rd party agents that ask them to use their names to start up 'companies' and claim their IT expenditure (for personal use) through this claim.

 

for the common scenario, agents tell you to start a website to promote something or 'start' a company and pay your friends/family minimum cpf so that they make up the 'employees' of your company. then you can buy things (ie laptop, pc, ipad, printer etc) for them to claim. they will submit the claims for you and split the returns afterwards.

 

the common phrase of them enticing you to join their scheme is "its very easy. we will settle everything for you. if ah gong is giving free money, why not take it?"

 

false reporting is still illegal the last time i checked. why take the risk for that few thousand dollars?

 

any mcfer has hopped on this train? has anybody heard of anyone jumping on this train already? whats their story?

[Tigerwoods]

Can Intro to all brudders the lobang ?

 

 

 

 

 

We all collectively expose them !

[Keithchue]

seen this going around, anyone have any idea how it is supposed to be done?

[Jman888]

PIC = Productivity and Innovation Credit

 

[Little_prince]

now govt clamping down.

 

pls be careful ah

[Strat]

ah gong money is never easy to earn.....

[Fcw75]

It's these people that spoil market for those genuinely claiming PIC.

[Jman888]

Things to Look Out for If Engaging Consultants to File PIC Claims

The PIC application process is simple and straightforward. To guide businesses in filing PIC cash payout claims, IRAS has published on its website a list of common mistakes to avoid when claiming PIC. Most businesses file their PIC cash payout claims themselves, but there may be businesses that prefer to engage PIC Consultants to assist them in claiming PIC benefits. Find out what you need to look out for if you are engaging consultants to file PIC claims.

Signs that you could be asked to participate in an unacceptable PIC arrangement

Vendors, salespersons and consultants may approach you and offer to help you claim PIC cash payout if you buy their products/ engage their services. Please be especially mindful of those who misrepresent the intention of the PIC scheme. Here are some signs that you could be asked to participate in an unacceptable PIC arrangement.

If you make incorrect PIC cash payout claims based on wrong advice by vendors, salespersons and consultants, you will face penalties as you are ultimately responsible for the accuracy of your PIC application. Please refer to the IRAS website or contact IRAS for assistance if you are unclear about the PIC scheme or wish to verify if the advice given to you by vendors, salespersons or consultants is accurate.

For PIC Consultants and Vendors

Find out what you need to know if you are a PIC Consultant or Vendor.

IRAS takes a serious view of any abuse of PIC scheme

IRAS takes a serious view of taxpayers who defraud the government. Offenders convicted of PIC fraud will have to pay a penalty of up to four times the amount of cash payout fraudulently obtained, and a fine of up to $50,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years. This includes any person who wilfully assist another person to obtain a cash payout or PIC bonus which he is not entitled to.

List of offenders convicted of PIC abuse:

• Sep 2013 Greenit Pte Ltd Fined and Penalised for Fraudulent PIC Claims; its Director Jailed and Penalised
• Feb 2014 Exel Mitsui Technologies Pte Ltd Fined and Penalised for False PIC Claims; its Director Jailed and Penalised
• Aug 2014 Media Grafix Pte Ltd Fined and Penalised for False PIC Claim

 

[Hydrocarbon]

seen this going around, anyone have any idea how it is supposed to be done?

 

Let me share a bit on what the TS is saying.

 

Before that, a little self intro: I'm doing sales in an IT Web development / programming firm, and while we inform our clients of the grants available to them, we don't deal in any illegal usage of the grants. How I know what's going on is because clients will sometimes tell us that other vendors are providing better "deals".

 

PIC = Productivity and Innovation Credit (http://iras.gov.sg/irashome/PIcredit.aspx)

 

Basically, what happens is IRAS is giving out money for investments in productivity enhancing equipment and systems. There's two parts to it, Enhanced Tax Deduction and Cash Payout.

 

Most of the time, the Enhanced Tax Deduction is ignored by such "consultants" and they will push for the Cash Payout portion.

 

Why? Because it's more lucrative mah!

 

It is a 60% "refund" of your qualified expenses, capped at $100,000 per FY. (I'll talk about the Bonus in a while.)

 

So, if you spend $15,000 on computers, printers, smartphone, etc, you'll get back $9,000 on your spending. That's good right? A no-contract iPhone 6 will cost roughly $400!! (I didn't google exact price, just giving example.)

 

In addition to that, there is a PIC Bonus! It's a dollar for dollar matching bonus on whatever you've spent, capped at $15,000.

 

So, if in the earlier example, you've spend $15,000 on your computers, etc, you'll get a matching bonus of $15,000. This is in addition to your Cash Payout of $9,000 (the earlier 60%).

 

Total refund = $9,000 + $15,000 = $24,000

 

You get $15,000 worth of equipment, and another $24,000 back as cash, so total value is $39,000.

 

Who don't want?

 

With this number in mind, some people will set up consultancies to "help" you "unlock" that "value", and that will cost you about 10% of what you're claiming (depending on consultancies, I've heard of 2.5% til 20%).

 

That's a rough overview on what's going on. Anyway, I'd advise you guys not to do that. There's gonna be a new legislation coming out soon, maybe early next year? Not sure when, but it's a Anti-PIC Abuse legislation to deal with such frauds. Hopefully, those frauds get exposed, and stop the abuse of such funding.

 

Anyone wanting to know more, can just ask, I'll do my best to answer. Been quite busy lately, so not as active here. =D

[GLZT]

PIC grant still relatively easy to claim. Those grants from spring sg much harder to claim.

But a lot of IT company purposely up their price cause they know we as business consumers can claim.

[Sorrow]

 

Let me share a bit on what the TS is saying.

 

Before that, a little self intro: I'm doing sales in an IT Web development / programming firm, and while we inform our clients of the grants available to them, we don't deal in any illegal usage of the grants. How I know what's going on is because clients will sometimes tell us that other vendors are providing better "deals".

 

PIC = Productivity and Innovation Credit (http://iras.gov.sg/irashome/PIcredit.aspx)

 

Basically, what happens is IRAS is giving out money for investments in productivity enhancing equipment and systems. There's two parts to it, Enhanced Tax Deduction and Cash Payout.

 

Most of the time, the Enhanced Tax Deduction is ignored by such "consultants" and they will push for the Cash Payout portion.

 

Why? Because it's more lucrative mah!

 

It is a 60% "refund" of your qualified expenses, capped at $100,000 per FY. (I'll talk about the Bonus in a while.)

 

So, if you spend $15,000 on computers, printers, smartphone, etc, you'll get back $9,000 on your spending. That's good right? A no-contract iPhone 6 will cost roughly $400!! (I didn't google exact price, just giving example.)

 

In addition to that, there is a PIC Bonus! It's a dollar for dollar matching bonus on whatever you've spent, capped at $15,000.

 

So, if in the earlier example, you've spend $15,000 on your computers, etc, you'll get a matching bonus of $15,000. This is in addition to your Cash Payout of $9,000 (the earlier 60%).

 

Total refund = $9,000 + $15,000 = $24,000

 

You get $15,000 worth of equipment, and another $24,000 back as cash, so total value is $39,000.

 

Who don't want?

 

With this number in mind, some people will set up consultancies to "help" you "unlock" that "value", and that will cost you about 10% of what you're claiming (depending on consultancies, I've heard of 2.5% til 20%).

 

That's a rough overview on what's going on. Anyway, I'd advise you guys not to do that. There's gonna be a new legislation coming out soon, maybe early next year? Not sure when, but it's a Anti-PIC Abuse legislation to deal with such frauds. Hopefully, those frauds get exposed, and stop the abuse of such funding.

 

Anyone wanting to know more, can just ask, I'll do my best to answer. Been quite busy lately, so not as active here. =D

I have people in my industry claiming till crazy, the consultant even told me one guy with whole year commission is only $2k plus for the Whole of the years claim , I was like wtf. Generally, the consultant would take a huge chunk of the claims.

 

Claim 40k for software development, TBH how much can software development can be now since they outsource to India etc and the template is already there. A few of my colleagues claim telling me the consultant say its saf and with cash back and stuffe, I thinking one day government asks u cough back the money is I think 4-5x of the amount claimed if I not wrong or jail term. For the 10k-15k spread of 5 years (IRAS record keeping requires 5yrs documentation), It's not worth the effort especially they can asks u for coffee anytime during that period.

 

Was telling a few guys, now they open door big big let the people claim till crazy, then they close up the door and slowly asks each of them to go for coffee, cannot justify good luck, pay back the penalty I think government also HuaT ah based on one claimant average of 30k, penalty maybe 120k.

[Kb27]

I run a legit company, I can't claim for anything.

Bcuz I'm sole proprietor.

I pay for everything out of my own pocket, including printers and computers.

 

Then you have cheaters around.

 

PIC claims is screwed up.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Kb27

[oleandero]

I run a legit company, I can't claim for anything.

Bcuz I'm sole proprietor.

I pay for everything out of my own pocket, including printers and computers.

 

Then you have cheaters around.

 

PIC claims is screwed up.

 

why cannot claim? not even tax relief? ur expenditures are not expenses in your company's books?

[Darryn]

 

why cannot claim? not even tax relief? ur expenditures are not expenses in your company's books?

For PIC must have three CPF employee in the quarter of the claim.

 

Many many things PIC claimable

 

Software development (off the shelf and custom) can be claimed - that means things like MS Word, can claim

The custom online quote system we developed for a client can claim

 

ePayment integration can also claim.

 

I have many claims for Content Management Systems

What CANNOT claim is marketing and content (which is also a big part of my business)

 

Apps for facebook and phone can claim (like the contest apps we custom programme)

 

For me I DO NOT claim on behalf of clients - nor do I fill the forms for them. It is not worth the liability of getting it wrong, besides, the forms are very very simple.

 

What I do though - I give the client detailed proposals / quotes detailing what we are providing, and outlining what are the benefits to the business.

 

Reading online,

what people have been called out for

a) Falsifying invoices and claiming for items they didn't buy

b) What I also suspect is buying items, and then reselling but claiming - bear in mind that for equipment must remain onsite for at least a year (eg: computer)

 

The other way I think is marking up the invoice unreasonably. For one claim we had to show that the project was done at "market rate" and that we didn't have a relationship with the client (easy enough, since they had three quotes and I was the middle one, but could show better service)

[Mrmilktooth]

Tot this scheme is ending this year?

 

Yes, have heard of such stories..

[oleandero]

For PIC must have three CPF employee in the quarter of the claim.

 

icic.. psps... i totally missed out the 'sole proprietor' part.

[Sorrow]

Tot this scheme is ending this year?

 

Yes, have heard of such stories..

Extended till 2018 if my memory didn't fail me.

[Ender]

Getting family members just to pay them minimum cpf so they are your employee. Isn't this the same as the phantom workers that mom came hard on those employers who cheat on the foreign workers quota? Got a few boss got jailed for this.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Ender