Joseph22 Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 Whatever is going on in AHPETC cannot be worst than what went on with the Admiralty CCC, which has been coveniently downplayed. So I would be very hesitant to conclude as what you have done "as for PAP... everyone know what is going on" If PA , led by Ministers, scholars, can commit such oversights , should we not be more forgiving of WP ? What AGO checked were only a sampling of some CCC, RC accounts. If they do a total 100% check of all RCs, CCCs, their report would run into 1000s of pages just for PA alone. Having interacted with some of these CCC, RC Chairmans, some of them would not even be eligible for for the lowest grade appointment in Civil Service. I know of one RC chairman who can't even write & read properly and yet he oversees large sums of monies. Seems to me that what u mean is its okay to be double standard for worker party.. Okay noted on ur point. If what the CCC Chairman did can be condoned then why the big fuss over the AHPETC issue? Because they haven't even explain to the public what is going on with their account. ↡ Advertisement 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neost 6th Gear July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 It seems to me the issue between Admiralty CCC and AHPETC is the same. Can someone tells me if my reading of the event is correct or wrong? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duckduck Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 (edited) back to d bigger pic: work n ethics culture starts frm d top: wat i wanna see: less planting of unqualified CEOs to heads of GLCs n more capable n hands on pple. Parachuting generals is the easy way to appointing a CEO. Getting a true commercially successful CEO is much harder coz they likely have great jobs now, but like soccer u need the best coaches to be the best, eg. mourinho, guardiola etc, n its not like u cant afford them... i will stop short of using the N word but y'all know where im coming from... this is a message to you IBs monitoring this thread... r u consolidating power or r u truly working for d pple? Edited July 20, 2015 by Duckduck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuPerBoRed Twincharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 (edited) back to d bigger pic: work n ethics culture starts frm d top: wat i wanna see: less planting of unqualified CEOs to heads of GLCs n more capable n hands on pple. Parachuting generals is the easy way to appointing a CEO. Getting a true commercially successful CEO is much harder coz they likely have great jobs now, but like soccer u need the best coaches to be the best, eg. mourinho, guardiola etc, n its not like u cant afford them... i will stop short of using the N word but y'all know where im coming from... this is a message to you IBs monitoring this thread... look there has to be a balance yes? ppl like you who say pay to get the genuine top talent with the GENUINE desire to serve the country... or the mercenaries who MUST be singaporeans to take a thankless job?? ie.. u are ok with the high wages.. i can find another 10 who absolutely hate the high pay ps.. for the record... i am agst p8p for 2 reasons 1. public transport woes 2. CPF inflexibility the rest.. can live with Edited July 20, 2015 by SuPerBoRed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxus-MIFA9 Supersonic July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 If what the CCC Chairman did can be condoned then why the big fuss over the AHPETC issue? How about $2/- capital company who could bid for millions dollars projects ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuPerBoRed Twincharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 (edited) If what the CCC Chairman did can be condoned then why the big fuss over the AHPETC issue? how can u say the CCC chairman is condoned when he has stepped down? becoz lack of prosecution?? if there is evidence of wrong doing... trust me.. he would be prosecuted... same for WP.. is there wrong doing? not clear evidence at this moment... but WP reluctance to reveal more really reeks.. thats all most ppl are saying Edited July 20, 2015 by SuPerBoRed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duckduck Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 look there has to be a balance yes? ppl like you who say pay to get the genuine top talent with the GENUINE desire to serve the country... or the mercenaries who MUST be singaporeans to take a thankless job?? for GLC CEOs, i dont believe we always need a singie. Hire an FT CEO if they want on totally commercial terms. no perform = fired coz theyre used to it n thats wat drives to over achieve. U give a singie general but wat it seems like he never gets fired no matter wat = a much worse situation long term Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph22 Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 for GLC CEOs, i dont believe we always need a singie. Hire an FT CEO if they want on totally commercial terms. no perform = fired coz theyre used to it n thats wat drives to over achieve. U give a singie general but wat it seems like he never gets fired no matter wat = a much worse situation long term Are they willing to take for such low wages??? I know millions is big to commoner like us. But ceo material Ang mo are likely getting more.. And if u give to them, the same set of complainer will say why give to foreigner. This will not end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustank Hypersonic July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 Transport and housing are the two main issue I have with pap... Guess what.. These two are actually the main reason a gahmen exist. My only problem.. Change gahmen will change the situation meh? housing problem solved liao lah only left transport defence = 95% education = 70% (because -25% from foreigners eating into our education budget, -5% for minister wind cold words) utilities = 95% ( - 15% for selling our power plants + 15% for water initiatives) parks = 95% (good enough parks) housing = 80% (good enough lah) food = 60% (- 35% for profiting from selling coffeeshop land) police = 70% (-30% for too many of those unsolved cases, not high handed enough for crimnals) fireman = 95% (those guys are good!) checkpoint = 80% (-15% for all the woodlands crap) transport = 30% (-30% for mrt crap, -30% for coe, -10% for all the minister I like to talk wind cold words) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philipkee Twincharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 Some comments. Ahpetc and admiralty CCC issue. Put it this way. Two children broke a vase each. For the first child, no matter how he try to explain, the teacher keep saying finding excuses. The second child explain with the same explanation as the first child and explanation accepted. When both children are presented to the principal, the child whose explanation is accepted is let off while the other one is not let off but questioned again and again until end of school term. Was the principal and teacher wrong not to accept explanation? No. Moral? Depends on which perspective. By the way, no explanation is ever fool proof. It is only an issue of how much you want to dig. As for salaries, no one is begrudging the millions of dollars salary but they are also asking for accountability as well. As in they resign or get sacked if they cannot perform instead of a sorry here and there with no changes. My two cents. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duckduck Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 (edited) Are they willing to take for such low wages??? I know millions is big to commoner like us. But ceo material Ang mo are likely getting more.. And if u give to them, the same set of complainer will say why give to foreigner. This will not end. IMO SG cannot b run exclusively for singies. Anyone who has been a successful CEO before will know how rare they are coz most biz fail n only d best survive. Even if we dont talk abt FTs, why is p8p unable to get more private singie CEOs to join GLCs? is a just salary issue, or equally impt the person theyre reporting to above them have issues? Edited July 20, 2015 by Duckduck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tohto Hypersonic July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 The issue isn't change of government but accountability. I am dead sure the incumbent will still be vote into the parliamentary. On a side note all government ministries should be stand alone and not affiliate with any policitical party. Change of government should not impact the functionality of ministries. Too bad, in Singapore you should know all are control by only ONE party. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryn Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 If what the CCC Chairman did can be condoned then why the big fuss over the AHPETC issue? What he did was not condoned - he has committed hari kari... Personally I see what he did as "bigger" than what WP has been accused of doing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryn Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 Anyone who with a good command of English and with some understanding of Law & Economic can write such a long manifesto but whether can that someone carry out what it had written is another side of the story. Under current situation, it takes time as 'they' are not the majority in power... That's the $64 Million question isn't it. Not speaking of politics specifically - but rather life in general - To me, it is particularly important to cultivate and encourage alternative viewpoints and ideas - to discuss different strategies and to explore different solutions. Every management book that you read talks about the dangers of things like "group think" or "echo chamber" - the concept of surrounding yourself with like minded people "blinding" you to different ways of thinking. Many times this happens unintentionally as "like minded people" tend to gravitate together. Furthermore, the successful often have difficulty understanding why others can succeed, intelectually they can be told, but emotionally it is very hard to grasp. This is why I feel that it's very important to have and encourage alternate voices - I know that the PAP does try to encourage to a certain extent, but no matter what, it's still a "certain personality" type that gravitates towards the PAP - and there is also quite a large concentration of power within the power at the top echelons. They are not necessarily "bad" or doing the "wrong" thing with their policies - there is no doubt that what is done, is done with rigour and intellect. The difference is that the more alternate voices that you have, the more you can be prepared for the idea or solution that comes out of left field, to suggest that one group, no matter how clever, methodical, inclusive has a monopoly on ideas I think does a disservice. This, to me, is why it's so important to cultivate credible viewpoints. Note well - I am talking about cultivating credible different viewpoints and philosophies to allow ideas to flow and flourish, not "helping" the opposition - by allowing more discussion we are helping ourselves. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joseph22 Turbocharged July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 (edited) housing problem solved liao lah only left transport defence = 95% education = 70% (because -25% from foreigners eating into our education budget, -5% for minister wind cold words) utilities = 95% ( - 15% for selling our power plants + 15% for water initiatives) parks = 95% (good enough parks) housing = 80% (good enough lah) food = 60% (- 35% for profiting from selling coffeeshop land) police = 70% (-30% for too many of those unsolved cases, not high handed enough for crimnals) fireman = 95% (those guys are good!) checkpoint = 80% (-15% for all the woodlands crap) transport = 30% (-30% for mrt crap, -30% for coe, -10% for all the minister I like to talk wind cold words) Housing price is still high. Yes u can say we have grant. But the question is how much grant do u want them to continue giving? Further more why punish those who work hard and hence loss out on the grant. What so meritocracy about it. Some comments. Ahpetc and admiralty CCC issue. Put it this way. Two children broke a vase each. For the first child, no matter how he try to explain, the teacher keep saying finding excuses. The second child explain with the same explanation as the first child and explanation accepted. When both children are presented to the principal, the child whose explanation is accepted is let off while the other one is not let off but questioned again and again until end of school term. Was the principal and teacher wrong not to accept explanation? No. Moral? Depends on which perspective. By the way, no explanation is ever fool proof. It is only an issue of how much you want to dig. As for salaries, no one is begrudging the millions of dollars salary but they are also asking for accountability as well. As in they resign or get sacked if they cannot perform instead of a sorry here and there with no changes. My two cents. Wrong analogy.. First child explain and later been remove of his position as prefect. The second child insist of keeping silence and say he only answer to his friends. Edited July 20, 2015 by Joseph22 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enye Hypersonic July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 just received gst voucher and utilities rebate vote PAP! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustank Hypersonic July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 just received gst voucher and utilities rebate vote PAP! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vid Hypersonic July 20, 2015 Share July 20, 2015 just received gst voucher and utilities rebate vote PAP! $500+ can buy over you... so cheap :D ↡ Advertisement Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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