Goldbug 6th Gear October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 Can we change the govt please? the Iranian govt was toppled in 1954 during operation AJAX when they nationalized the oil fields ↡ Advertisement Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben5266 Supercharged October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 That is not true, how can a petrol engine be more efficient than a gas fired power plant? Imagine how much will be your electricity bill if your home is powered by a diesel power generator? some energy is loss in the delivery to your home. the transformers, power cables are not superconductor. Then, inefficiency in converting electricity into lithium ion battery in the car. Then, convert again from lithium ion to move the car. a gas water heater is more economical than an electric heater. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 (edited) some energy is loss in the delivery to your home. the transformers, power cables are not superconductor. Then, inefficiency in converting electricity into lithium ion battery in the car. Then, convert again from lithium ion to move the car. a gas water heater is more economical than an electric heater. yup......i used to work in a power generation company......efficiency never cross 20%......always at around 18% according to our nightly reoort.If anybody can achieve 25% efficiency they will be multi-billionaire now! Edited October 4, 2014 by Eviilusion Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodooman Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 yup......i used to work in a power generation company......efficiency never cross 20%......always at around 18% according to our nightly reoort.If anybody can achieve 25% efficiency they will be multi-billionaire now! In Singapore? I thought we are using combined cycle gas turbine plants, so thermal efficiency is in the range of 40-50%? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 In Singapore? I thought we are using combined cycle gas turbine plants, so thermal efficiency is in the range of 40-50%?40-50%? dont think so lar....i worked at a small plant.....~60mw.....loss is due not through inefficiency...but through natural loss! Leakages and such......heat needs to be transfrred by convection through the water tube which turns the water to steam....steam fed to turbines....and turbines turns the generators....the process is long and pressure very high.....so efficiency affected! Its not about the fuel used but the process! And must remember....flue gas and other resultant pollutants need to be treated and that cost a lot of money. Many factors plays a part in the efficiency of a plant...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodooman Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 40-50%? dont think so lar....i worked at a small plant.....~60mw.....loss is due not through inefficiency...but through natural loss! Leakages and such......heat needs to be transfrred by convection through the water tube which turns the water to steam....steam fed to turbines....and turbines turns the generators....the process is long and pressure very high.....so efficiency affected! Its not about the fuel used but the process! And must remember....flue gas and other resultant pollutants need to be treated and that cost a lot of money. Many factors plays a part in the efficiency of a plant...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxus-MIFA9 Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 Frankly speaking, do you guys really see petrol price before refilling? Up or down is like 2-3 cents at most. Each time I refill, standard statement: "Uncle, 95 full tank." And I will walk to counter. I don't really see the price. See leow sim tiah ... When I reach the kiosk, just tell the attendant 95. See also need to pump, don't see also need to pump if you still want to drive your car... 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 (edited) 40-50%? dont think so lar....i worked at a small plant.....~60mw.....loss is due not through inefficiency...but through natural loss! Leakages and such......heat needs to be transfrred by convection through the water tube which turns the water to steam....steam fed to turbines....and turbines turns the generators....the process is long and pressure very high.....so efficiency affected! Its not about the fuel used but the process! And must remember....flue gas and other resultant pollutants need to be treated and that cost a lot of money. Many factors plays a part in the efficiency of a plant...... yup....thats the theory without auxilliaries......40-50% heat tansfer is achievable! Powerplant needs many auxilliary equipments and processes which may be as large as the boiler and turbine system! Its not as simple as theory makes it out to be. I was laughed at when i scoffed at the 18% efficiency report when i was doing my 1st report........hahaha! Edited October 4, 2014 by Eviilusion 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodooman Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 yup....thats the theory without auxilliaries......40-50% heat tansfer is achievable! Powerplant needs many auxilliary equipments and processes which may be as large as the boiler and turbine system! Its not as simple as theory makes it out to be. I was laughed at when i scoffed at the 18% efficiency report when i was doing my 1st report........hahaha! Interesting but shouldn't we then run our own generators to power individual homes? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 Interesting but shouldn't we then run our own generators to power individual homes?i think our gov wont allow...noise and environment pollution is an issue! Best is install those modern solar panel....free fuel for the batteries but it is a bit expensive! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben5266 Supercharged October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 Interesting but shouldn't we then run our own generators to power individual homes? Can. You just need to figure out how to top up the diesel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 (edited) Can. You just need to figure out how to top up the diesel. can....why not.....there are generators that can fit into a a storeroom....the bigger ones can fit into a bedroom nicely and they can power up your home and more than 1 airconditioning unit. But the exhaust of these generators is the main problem and its very noisy too! No problem with refueling as there is a diesel ank for storage not sure about the consumption though.....must ask those 7 month getai operators.....they always use this type of generators. Edited October 4, 2014 by Eviilusion Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodooman Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 can....why not.....there are generators that can fit into a a storeroom....the bigger ones can fit into a bedroom nicely and they can power up your home and more than 1 airconditioning unit. But the exhaust of these generators is the main problem and its very noisy too! No problem with refueling as there is a diesel ank for storage not sure about the consumption though.....must ask those 7 month getai operators.....they always use this type of generators. I am curious to know if electricity produced by a stand alone diesel generator will cost more or less than the electricity I am buying from SP, generated mostly by combined cycle power plants? Diesel is expensive, I read. You are telling me the world is moving in the wrong direction, from diesel to coal and gas, in the last few decades? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 (edited) I am curious to know if electricity produced by a stand alone diesel generator will cost more or less than the electricity I am buying from SP, generated mostly by combined cycle power plants? Diesel is expensive, I read. You are telling me the world is moving in the wrong direction, from diesel to coal and gas, in the last few decades? i really dont know......u should ask those in the construction industries as they always have their own generators! Maybe can ask those COW.......they are usually in charge. Singapore has switched to natural gas.....and it reported to be cheaper with lesser price fluctuation (correct me if i am wrong).....but our tariff remains about the same! Edited October 4, 2014 by Eviilusion Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben5266 Supercharged October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 (edited) I am curious to know if electricity produced by a stand alone diesel generator will cost more or less than the electricity I am buying from SP, generated mostly by combined cycle power plants? Diesel is expensive, I read. You are telling me the world is moving in the wrong direction, from diesel to coal and gas, in the last few decades? Ok... I pick a small diesel generator. Power is 46kW. The fuel consumption is 13.7l/h. 1 liter diesel is currently $1.65. Total cost for 46kWh is $22.605 Electricity tariff is $0.2705 kWh Electricity cost for 45kWh is $12.443. So, it is cheaper to use the power from the grid than to self generate. But... if we could get the diesel from Malaysia at RM2.20 per liter or $0.86, then the self generate cost will be S$11.78. Cheaper than SingPower! Ok... we are big carrot head. Edited October 4, 2014 by Ben5266 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evillusion Supersonic October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 Ok... I pick a small diesel generator. Power is 46kW. The fuel consumption is 13.7l/h. 1 liter diesel is currently $1.65. Total cost for 46kWh is $22.605 Electricity tariff is $0.2705 kWh Electricity cost for 45kWh is $12.443. So, it is cheaper to use the power from the grid than to self generate. But... if we could get the diesel from Malaysia at RM2.20 per liter or $0.86, then the self generate cost will be S$11.78. Cheaper than SingPower! Ok... we are big carrot head. 46kw is a lot sia......u running chiller har? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben5266 Supercharged October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 46kw is a lot sia......u running chiller har? Small data center. The genset is about the size of full size MPV. btw, it has 240 liter of tank. with 10l/h consumption, a full tank can only last 24 hours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happily1986 5th Gear October 4, 2014 Share October 4, 2014 Interesting but shouldn't we then run our own generators to power individual homes? your thermal efficiency will be worse off. ↡ Advertisement 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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