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Honda Vezel

Hsiao

By Hsiao,
in Japanese Talk

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LEEST

LEEST

1st Gear

 

Hi sis, can be deactivate. there is a button located above the auto shift stick with "A". Press that and will deactivate it. It will switch back on again everytime u start your car.

 

Thank you, bro!

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Friendstar

Friendstar

Supercharged

Hi guys,

 

Would like to comment on my first week of Hybrid Z ownership.

 

There's many comments I saw on why should we purchase a Hybrid, due to the following concerns. I will address each of them.

 

1) The 5 infamous recalls of the 7-Speed dual-clutch gearbox in Japan

 

Yes, granted that the i-DCD system has been recalled 5 times. And FIXED. I know we all have some jitters about such recalls especially for a Japan made product, and what's more we are not covered by Kah Motors but individual PIs workshops which we might not trust.

 

Ok, lets be objective about this. We are talking about Made-in-Japan, there's extreme pride in the Japanese people to fix these issues and make sure they do not manifest again. My vehicle has been verified to be produced and updated with the latest software before shipping out to Singapore, so I have confidence it will not happen.

 

Even if touch wood the unfortunate happen, I don't believe the DSG impossible to fix. The Japanese will not allow that. In honesty, Honda used to have more serious problems with their first generation CVTs, which mostly could not last more than 200,000km without breaking down. These are the very CVTs running in all the auto GD1 Jazz/Fits, City and Airwave.

 

If you dig deeper into the recalls, it is generally a software bug that causes the gearbox not to operate. 5 iterations of software updates, I am quite sure these goblins are eradicated.

 

 

2) Concerns about the hybrid battery lifespan

 

You might have heard of horror stories of Civic Hybrids having to replace their full battery pack at Kah Motors and charging them 10 grand. However, we need to look at the very root of the issue; NiMh batteries. These batteries are old-tech. The next generation of batteries are Li-Ion/Po.

 

Honda states the new Lithium-Ion battery pack can possibly have a lifespan of 10 years, provided you take good care of it. Given our weather, I don't fully expect the battery to be problem free for 10 years, but I also don't expect them to give up within 5 years. In fact, the battery pack being Li-Ion means that there is a possibility of changing out individual retired cells in the battery array. This means greater serviceability and durability of the entire battery pack.

 

Moreover, as technology improves, we expect battery prices to drop within 5 years. I mean come on, look at your handphones! We were hard-pressed to get even 500 mAh from our old Nokia NiMh batts, but the same form factor can pack >2500 mAh in Li-Ion form today, are we are nonplussed to charge them with China charges and even sleep next to them.

 

Give technology a chance!

 

 

3) Overall cost increase VS the fuel savings

 

Yes, the Hybrid costs so much more than the standard Vezel and the average FC is probably only around 5-7 km/L better than the standard Vezel, which means that fuel savings are insignificant compared to the cost delta. By pure logic, it makes zero sense to purchase the Hybrid for savings.

 

Which, in Singapore, is exactly true!

 

We are not buying high to save money on petrol. We are buying technology, the chance to own a fine piece of Honda engineering and savouring how the whole package comes together. We are paying for the ability to utilize Japan's first homegrown DSG (Mitsu Evo X SST is built by Getrag Germany, not counted), and the option of driving like a pussy hyper-miler or a decent 150+ hp 7-speed quick shifting vehicle. FYI the 2.0L CR-V has around 155hp but lugs a 1.5 ton body around.

 

I enjoy the Hybrid every time I start it up, crawl out of my carpark on pure EV mode, and have great fun doing a max economy run, which sometimes I easily cross 27 km/l on ideal conditions. Or I can be a idiot and engage Sports mode and rage through traffic with the excellent handling characteristics of the Vezel (although its really harsh). Hey, it has i-VTEC and DOHC after all!

 

The premium I paid for the Hybrid can never be justified in terms of fuel savings. However, you also cannot quantify the ability to switch from Mr Jekyll to Mr Hyde at a flick of a button. Its fun! This is why I love Honda, and why I love my Vezel Hybrid.

 

So for those guys who really sitting on the fence between Hybrid and non-Hybrid, my invitation to test drive the Hybrid still stands, just PM me if you need just that little nudge to be convinced ;) ! And even so, follow your heart to buy the Vezel. I am just sharing my honest viewpoints from a Hybrid owner.

 

Cheers!

 

 

 

 

U used words like "possibility", "possibly".

 

For instance, possibility of changing of individual cell.

 

Honda said the battery can possibly last 10 years.

 

When U consider pure combustion engine, u won't see such words appearing.

I.e. consumers and even manufacturers cannot be 100% certain about its reliability. And Singapore's hot weather of high temp and humidity kills batteries. Well known.

 

Most people buy hybrid to save fuel and lower their petrol cost. I'm not sure if people are looking at buying technology.

 

Parallel import... and the pride of Japanese. I'm really speechless at this. Its all about money.

 

Have u heard about the resale value of hybrid at year 5?

 

Ultimately u r happy with ur purchase, that's the most important! Enjoy ur ride!

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pokadot

pokadot

2nd Gear

Read in the other thread in this forum, Kah will be showcasing the HRV at next week motor show.

 

It seems Kah motor took lesson from Borneo to bring in a hot model before the PIs take all the biz away. Way to go...Kah motors.

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Googoo

Googoo

4th Gear
(edited)

Read in the other thread in this forum, Kah will be showcasing the HRV at next week motor show.

 

 

but at honda fb, they only mentioned they will be showcasing the mobilio, no mention on HRV... hmm..

Edited by Googoo
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Watwheels

Watwheels

Supersonic

I think the hybrid version will be better to drive with the extra torque from the electric motor. It will not struggle to keep up or struggle to do overtaking moves.

 

But I have some doubts on its handling. Most Crossover or SUVs have independent and multi-link rear suspension. When I looked at the specs and see the "axle type" rear suspension I knew it has to be a torsion beam liao. This really reinforce the "jacked up FWD hatchback".

 

Although it's light weight for its class the 1.5L will struggle. 0-60km/hr maybe not much issue for 1-2 driver/passenger. I think most of us know. I previously own the FD1 Civic the 1.8L gets out of breath on higher speeds and you have to wring the engine at 4K-5K rpm to get the max torque out.

 

I know new owners are excited but I won't read everything good about it. For any car there's sure to have a downside of things. It's all depending on your priorities when you choose one. Cheers.

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Dafansu

Dafansu

Turbocharged

 

 

but at honda fb, they only mentioned they will be showcasing the mobilio, no mention on HRV... hmm..

 

It's posted by the other member in the motorshow thread, need confirmation with Kah

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Niltrams

Niltrams

3rd Gear

U used words like "possibility", "possibly".

 

For instance, possibility of changing of individual cell.

 

Honda said the battery can possibly last 10 years.

 

When U consider pure combustion engine, u won't see such words appearing.

I.e. consumers and even manufacturers cannot be 100% certain about its reliability. And Singapore's hot weather of high temp and humidity kills batteries. Well known.

 

Most people buy hybrid to save fuel and lower their petrol cost. I'm not sure if people are looking at buying technology.

 

Parallel import... and the pride of Japanese. I'm really speechless at this. Its all about money.

 

Have u heard about the resale value of hybrid at year 5?

 

Ultimately u r happy with ur purchase, that's the most important! Enjoy ur ride!

 

Friendstar,

 

I'm sure VW did not expect the DSG fiasco to manifest itself so badly in our tropical climate too. Never in VW technical documents did it state it will last forever too. Manufacturers will always put a warranty on the expected lifespan of their components before the probability of the parts failing rises up, e.g. 100,000km or 6 years etc etc. After that period, the possibility of the parts failing increases, and car owners will need to do preventive maintenance. This is normal, Hybrid or not.

 

Yes I agree Singapore's climate sucks for batteries. It is well-known; thats for Nickel Metal Hydride battery forms. That's why I put in effort to point out that the new battery pack consists of Lithium-Ion cells, which are much more resistant to cell degradation, electrode crystallization and pack a higher energy density than NiMh cells can dream of. Li-Ion is next gen hybrid battery technology. Manufacturers don't release new technology into the wild if it is not proven to be an improvement in all aspects, durability and energy density.

 

Lastly, yes, I agree with you that people buy Hybrid to lower petrol cost over its lifespan, if I am an American or Japanese. However, I am a SIngaporean, and the notion of savings is already stupidly negated by the substantial cost difference right at the start. So now, buying this Hybrid becomes an exercise in buying techonology, and the "shiok-ness" of owning cutting edge technology. Case in point, the BMW F30 335i and the ActiveHybrid3. This I feel should be the mentality of potential Hybrid owners in Singapore.

 

Resale value of Hybrid? The point I am trying to bring across is, we do not buy cars in the current purchasing environment (CEVs rebate reducing our Minimum PARF rebate pathetically) to consider selling them after 5 years. Instead we should be looking at keeping the car for 10 years, so we need to be very prudent in our initial purchase.

 

Its all about the money, you are right. You must be well-informed in making your purchase, that's why I am sharing information on this forum for everyone. This is what a forum is all about.

 

Cheers!

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wkloh

wkloh

2nd Gear

Bros, i found that alot if not all of the PIs are not allowing test drive. I mean if you are a new company or the car is new I'll understand but the car has been out for 6 mths.

 

If a PI is in for the long haul (supporting Vezel buyers for 10 years), a test drive should be the very basic. If they can't, it feels like a hit and run kind of sale then how can you even trust them for 10 years? Even helpful bros like Nitram can offer a test drive. I have made up my mind to not buy from any PIs who don't offer a test drive. I cannot trust them if they don't commit to selling the car.

 

What are your views? Especially bros who bought without testing the car.

Just my 2 cents only..

Lets say the PI allow test drive. And serious buyer went to enquire & test drive. I wonder is there anyone will say that "Ok, I will take this car that I had tested" [hur] (unless he has special reason la..)

But when we order the car, we say we wait for the shipment or non-test drive one. [nod]

So finally who gonna buy that test drive car from the poor PI? He ownself buy it? Wow, then he probably has many models.. [:p]

I need to clarify that I am also a customer, not a PI. Also just speaking my thoughts to be fair to the PIs.. [grin]

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wkloh

wkloh

2nd Gear

The Aircon cut off ?? It shouldn't be working this way... The engine should cut off not the Aircon .

But the Aircon setting have affect on the auto off function like I mention in my earlier post.

I realize that when was trying to figure out why the auto engine off function only works in the morning and not afternoon ... Then I realize it's bcos in the morning, I set the Aircon to >19deg and in the afternoon, I set to 18degC (Lo)

The auto engine off function will be disabled if the Aircon is set to18degC. I've confirmed it by driving round using different Aircon setting temperature .

Not sure why honda does this... Probably at 18degC it needs more engine power ?

So far I din experience such issue. I usually set my AC @ 24.

But base on your description, I think it has something to do with the battery (or Capacitor). If I am not wrong, why the Vazel can afford to off the engine or allow using of anxilaries during engine off is cos of its Capacitor at the boot. So if the stored energy is insufficient to sustain the Aircon or any other running equipments, it will not allow the engine to switch off so that the latter can charge up the Capacitor until "boleh"..

This is what I think so.. [idea]

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Anzz

Anzz

1st Gear

Agree that it's all calculated risk. Now i have the cash ready but i just can't find a PI i can trust! Interesting situation huh? I'm feel like giving up go whack the CRV at Kah motors.

 

I said earlier that I visited a PI who let me test drive a test car. An S series. But when I wanted to test a Hybrid at the corner, he said it's a new car waiting collection so cannot. That's fine so i left and went for lunch but when i past by the place again, he brought someone out using that exact "new" car. It's a maroon colour hybrid. To bros who just collected a maroon hybrid within past 2 weeks pm me I'll let you know which PI...

 

How to trust right?

 

Haha, my customer told me his friend car had being used as a test drive at Turf City. Anyone here, my advice to you, if you are going to test drive please put on the TRADE PLATE. Make sure you are being cover under insurance etc..... If not say bye bye to your driving licence!

 

 

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PeterParker

PeterParker

Clutched

Just my 2 cents only..

Lets say the PI allow test drive. And serious buyer went to enquire & test drive. I wonder is there anyone will say that "Ok, I will take this car that I had tested" [hur] (unless he has special reason la..)

But when we order the car, we say we wait for the shipment or non-test drive one. [nod]

So finally who gonna buy that test drive car from the poor PI? He ownself buy it? Wow, then he probably has many models.. [:p]

I need to clarify that I am also a customer, not a PI. Also just speaking my thoughts to be fair to the PIs.. [grin]

Many people got your same views here it seems - be fair to the PIs. The ironic thing is that the PI, even the salesperson is driving a bigger car than most of us.

 

So i guess all the PIs has to do is to talk you to believe in the product, something like insurance, and you commit 120k to it. No test drive, just a brochure, words and the hype? I don't think i can do the same and that's fine. I guess the Vezel sells by itself.

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chinaman76

chinaman76

1st Gear

Brothers can i get some advise, which credit card gives more petrol savings/discount

I'm using NTUC Plus and Esso. Savings supposed to be over 19%. However, some are rebates in Link points. Hope this helps.

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