Berkeley study of how wealth affects the mind..

[BennyEd]

  On 7/18/2013 at 3:42 AM, Hydrocarbon said:

Yeah, the few lazy buggers are the one that spoil market for the hardworking ones. Don't understand why they don't want to rely on themselves? Not referring to those too old, too sick, too weak ones, but the generally ok ones, but super lazy.

 

Yah...sad how rich misers use them as an excuse not to donate and help the poor.

[Throttle2]

There is no need for a study to be done to know the "side effects" of being rich.

How many people, in our lives, have we seen, became worse when they become richer?

I would say, 9 out of 10. This is human nature.

 

Money is the root of evil mah, thought we all already knew that.

 

But this doesnt mean that a poor guy is a good guy or a rich guy is a bad guy.

 

[Thaiyotakamli]

  On 7/18/2013 at 5:10 PM, Throttle2 said:

There is no need for a study to be done to know the "side effects" of being rich.

How many people, in our lives, have we seen, became worse when they become richer?

I would say, 9 out of 10. This is human nature.

 

Money is the root of evil mah, thought we all already knew that.

 

But this doesnt mean that a poor guy is a good guy or a rich guy is a bad guy.

and luckily u didnt turn bad with so many millions after wiping tables for years

 

nicely said, $ is the root of all evil and these evil think $ can buy everything. To them $ is power

 

 

 

 

 

but hor dont u think being rich even going down from expensive car, walk normal, people see it as c0cky action? just because he get down from an expensive car.

So sometimes the rich is being abused hahaha

[OmOm]

Money is just the means to an end. However, due to its versatility in being exchangeable for many other resources (food, shelter, sex, etc), it has become the most sought-after resource proxy in modern-day society.

 

The glorification of the pursuit of money in the ever-increasing capitalist world by the media and governments of the world has made it the "right" thing to do for the masses ala the "if everyone is doing it, it must be right" mentality.

 

A surplus of resources grants the individual tremendous leverage and ability to do things. Material wealth is a form of empowerment. The more money we have, the more we can do.

 

The root of the situations that you have cited is self-centeredness. It is about I, me and myself.

 

People focus so much today on making more money, earning higher salaries and returns on investments. They have little time and desire to learn more about themselves and their nature.

 

As the world shifts towards consumerism and capitalism, fewer people will experience growth in spirituality and the awareness of the impact of one's thoughts and actions.

 

For many of the materially rich, it is a convergence of self-centeredness and empowerment that results in bad accidents and generally bad behaviour.

 

Yet not all materially rich people behave badly. There are also many who manage to keep their self-centeredness at bay through either wisdom or discipline and employ the resources that they have to help other people. Their personal empowerment then magnifies their ability to benefit society.

 

  On 7/17/2013 at 4:56 AM, Hydrocarbon said:

In recent and not so recent times, we've seen the famous Ferrari speeding, running the red lights and crashing into the taxi, we've seen a BMW 7 series parking at the exit of a parking lot, blocking other drivers from exiting, we've seen a Lexus crashing into another vehicle and running from the accident. Granted, there are still accidents caused by not so rich people, but it seems that the rich people are taking over the news with their antics.

 

Why?

 

Maybe this video can shed some light.

 

 

[CH_CO]

Thus the mentality that you are rich so you are expected to do more and if you don't the same negativeness would be amplify in the same way. Greed and jealousy is always there , some would claim others Hao Lian when they expose their wealth while other will try to be you in various ways. It is easy to share what you don't need but it is less easy for you to share something neccessary .

 

While it is easy to be self centered but how many here can claim he is truly selfless ? Would you share the fruits of success with one which did nothing during your struggles and continue to do nothing when they are supposed to?

Edited July 19, 2013 by CH_CO

[Chucky2007]

Sometimes rich folks very tiring...especially the ones in SG..

 

Imagine when u earn $1mil income each year with hardwork, pay close to 200k in income tax, thinking the income tax will somehow help society bec tax paid is supposed to contribute to government funds so that the government have a better financial means to help the lesser folks.. then government is so rich but they are spending not as much in social welfare to help the needy, but keep investing and hope for bigger treasury reserve but even when reserve increased, the payout helps still remain little.. and now there's call for rich to help more in the poor..

 

Most rich nations provide free education, especially important the tertiary education, bec most nation realised the key to a no poverty nation is education.

 

But there are rich nations who simply make it very difficult to get free education.. the poor ones got to prove that they are poor and the rich ones can't have the free state education even though they contributed to the wealth of the nation as well. This creates a sense of inequality among rich and poor.

 

I feel uncomfortable when a government keep talking about rich should give back more to society when the government themselves don't seems to practice that.

[OmOm]

No one is expected to be perfectly altruistic. At the same time, being totally self-centred has its own negative repercussions.

 

I believe it is all about finding the sweet spot in between the two extremes of things.

 

In much the same way, meritocracy has its virtues but when it is carried to the extreme, it becomes divisive to the community or even nation.

 

Thus meritocracy has to be tempered with compassion, in particular for those who are unable to help themselves e.g. physical or mental limitations. For those who can help themselves, create the opportunities for them to learn and grow so that they can grow themselves to be stronger and more independent.

 

  On 7/19/2013 at 1:07 AM, CH_CO said:

Thus the mentality that you are rich so you are expected to do more and if you don't the same negativeness would be amplify in the same way. Greed and jealousy is always there , some would claim others Hao Lian when they expose their wealth while other will try to be you in various ways. It is easy to share what you don't need but it is less easy for you to share something neccessary .

 

While it is easy to be self centered but how many here can claim he is truly selfless ? Would you share the fruits of success with one which did nothing during your struggles and continue to do nothing when they are supposed to?

 

[OmOm]

We do not need to be anti-government, neither do we need to be pro-government.

 

Before we point fingers, let us find out the facts.

 

How much is being spent on social welfare and schemes to help the needy?

 

From a quantitative perspective, how much money needs to be spent each year for that?

 

From a qualitative perspective, what do we need to see happening before we come to the conclusion that sufficient monies and initiatives have been allocated for social welfare?

 

The key reason for much unhappiness that many people have is the transparency (or perhaps lack thereof) when it comes to the national reserves.

 

How much is available? What is it being used for and its eventual purpose? What would constitute a rainy day?

 

There does not even have to be 100% clarity and transparency but existing public information available about the nation's reserve funds is definitely lacking, at least from the view-point of the man-in-the-street.

 

  On 7/19/2013 at 2:54 AM, Chucky2007 said:

Sometimes rich folks very tiring...especially the ones in SG..

 

Imagine when u earn $1mil income each year with hardwork, pay close to 200k in income tax, thinking the income tax will somehow help society bec tax paid is supposed to contribute to government funds so that the government have a better financial means to help the lesser folks.. then government is so rich but they are spending not as much in social welfare to help the needy, but keep investing and hope for bigger treasury reserve but even when reserve increased, the payout helps still remain little.. and now there's call for rich to help more in the poor..

 

Most rich nations provide free education, especially important the tertiary education, bec most nation realised the key to a no poverty nation is education.

 

But there are rich nations who simply make it very difficult to get free education.. the poor ones got to prove that they are poor and the rich ones can't have the free state education even though they contributed to the wealth of the nation as well. This creates a sense of inequality among rich and poor.

 

I feel uncomfortable when a government keep talking about rich should give back more to society when the government themselves don't seems to practice that.

 

[Lethalstrike]

OmOm, why are you wasting your time here? You should be gunning for the next elections to make some real changes.

 

Jokes aside, i share the same views as you, especially that meritocracy has to be balanced with compassion. In the other thread about the entitlement mentailty of Singaporean workers, it seems that certain people have the views that the success they had today is due to their own efforts only, and the rest who are worse off are lazy and stupid, whom need to be taught a hard lesson in life to make it. This echoes our skewed sense of meritocracy that our government had imbued within the Singaporean society and mentality. This is the mistake and oversight in our policies as we advanced too fast to secure our relevance and so-called ability to "punch above our own weight" in South-East Asia.

 

Back to your question on our National Reserves, an old man once said it is purposely kept under wraps as a form of strategic defence for the SGD. That way, no one really knows how much we really had and in a way, it will be hard for countries with ulterior motives to bring us down. Such thinking might be relevant during old man's time, but in today's climate, i had doubts over the efficacy of this strategy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OmOm]

Bro, if you are up for it, I will be most glad to do so. Alone there is little what one can do. Real changes can only come when there is a party of kindred spirits who truly believe what they think, say and do.

 

On a more serious note, serving in public office is definitely not a walk in the park. There is much sacrifice to be made - family time is limited, loss of privacy and, for some, even a distinct loss of income.

 

Add to that having to constantly think about how one's policies can vastly affect the lives of millions of people amidst the turbulent global dynamics and it is no wonder why many talented folks prefer a more carefree lifestyle to a life of "self-sacrifice" in public office.

 

Anyway, we digress so let's get back to topic.

 

  On 7/19/2013 at 4:51 AM, Lethalstrike said:

OmOm, why are you wasting your time here? You should be gunning for the next elections to make some real changes.

 

Jokes aside, i share the same views as you, especially that meritocracy has to be balanced with compassion. In the other thread about the entitlement mentailty of Singaporean workers, it seems that certain people have the views that the success they had today is due to their own efforts only, and the rest who are worse off are lazy and stupid, whom need to be taught a hard lesson in life to make it. This echoes our skewed sense of meritocracy that our government had imbued within the Singaporean society and mentality. This is the mistake and oversight in our policies as we advanced too fast to secure our relevance and so-called ability to "punch above our own weight" in South-East Asia.

 

Back to your question on our National Reserves, an old man once said it is purposely kept under wraps as a form of strategic defence for the SGD. That way, no one really knows how much we really had and in a way, it will be hard for countries with ulterior motives to bring us down. Such thinking might be relevant during old man's time, but in today's climate, i had doubts over the efficacy of this strategy.

 

[CH_CO]

  On 7/19/2013 at 4:51 AM, Lethalstrike said:

OmOm, why are you wasting your time here? You should be gunning for the next elections to make some real changes.

 

Jokes aside, i share the same views as you, especially that meritocracy has to be balanced with compassion. In the other thread about the entitlement mentailty of Singaporean workers, it seems that certain people have the views that the success they had today is due to their own efforts only, and the rest who are worse off are lazy and stupid, whom need to be taught a hard lesson in life to make it. This echoes our skewed sense of meritocracy that our government had imbued within the Singaporean society and mentality. This is the mistake and oversight in our policies as we advanced too fast to secure our relevance and so-called ability to "punch above our own weight" in South-East Asia.

 

Back to your question on our National Reserves, an old man once said it is purposely kept under wraps as a form of strategic defence for the SGD. That way, no one really knows how much we really had and in a way, it will be hard for countries with ulterior motives to bring us down. Such thinking might be relevant during old man's time, but in today's climate, i had doubts over the efficacy of this strategy.

 

To correct your perspective , i have never said of my own effort .I have mentioned many times before , Singapore has provide the poor with an avenue like no other place other than US to succeed in life. I only mentioned instead on complaining and falling to the victim's mentality where the country fails and placing all the faults to the garmen and not one self . Has anyone which are whiny here have actually complemented the garmen for giving you a good education and a safe environment free from war and discrimination? I don't see that , i only see complains on what they isn't not how to improve by participation.

 

Again i would ask you , as compared to one which works hard while spending only his free time here , while the other spend 70% of his time here trying to blame the garmen for his own demise who is better off. And what makes you think the ones which has succeed with his own hard work didn't give back to the society which he receive help from? I can tell you in the face these are typically the people which gives the most back as they understood how it felt to be poor.

 

As compare to the "freedom" fighters which ask for equality but when asked if they had actually volunteer to help in any way , well prove me wrong ? So paying lip service would make things better? Self centered self rightness with no action won't get anything done . There are many here which have good job are wasting their time here doing non productive work me included, yet give all so crap telling the whole world what they think is wrong? Who should wake up?

 

I cite an example , i come from the credit department , i do receive reports on various people falling into debt , the main reasons of these people is not because of so called family problems like sickness or accidents but many fail because of their own doing. The loose credit given by the banks and financial system has given many the chance to own many things many times their income - i.e cars , 42 inch t.v , rolex watch , holiday , money to gamble.

 

These things are deem as a luxury which is only bought when one has money , are now available to those who don't have it. This inturn means they will have to scrimp on something else for them to be able to continue living their present lifestyles = lesser savings , lower safety nets and probably no medical insurance for their family whatsoever. So when times goes bad , suddenly they wake up on what they are doing and tend to recover shortly. These are the lucky ones. There are many in this region and a recession or any form of correction in the economy would wake these people up.

 

The unlucky ones which chose to enjoy first pay later , i have heard of cases where their family fall ill and they aren't able to "repay" for the bills and coupled with their own wrong doings , the impact is made double and the family falls into poverty. These in turn affects the children and it is a negative cycle. People in these family would probably have the entitlement and victim effect where the garmen has done nothing to help them.

 

I ask again , if one has proper savings and worked hard since the 60s throughout 90s where even un educated workers can find good money , they would have probably earned enough for retirements if they saved and what kind of under privilleged do you wanna claim on those which have fell out of it. Cause and effect.

 

I am pretty certain where there are cases where they have worked hard and they were unlucky , these people deserve help while others which chose to enjoy themselves when they were young and fallen to bad times when society changes , these i am less incline to help.

Edited July 19, 2013 by CH_CO

[Thaiyotakamli]

So link to topic, does a rich govt become more selfish and yaya papaya act?

[Lethalstrike]

Relax, my comments are not targeted at you.

 

I'm merely making a very general statement of my own observations, thus i used "certain people" and not "a certain individual".

 

Btw, i am not in disagreement with your values on financial prudency and hardwork, which are fast diminishing with the availability of easy credit nowadays. But, our definition of success through meritocracy should be changed, and not be so skewed towards monetary attainment and using it as the only critical yardstick when measuring success in Singapore.

 

Easier said than done though, as mentalities can only be changed after a few generations.

[CH_CO]

  On 7/19/2013 at 6:33 AM, Lethalstrike said:

Relax, my comments are not targeted at you.

 

I'm merely making a very general statement of my own observations, thus i used "certain people" and not "a certain individual".

 

Btw, i am not in disagreement with your values on financial prudency and hardwork, which are fast diminishing with the availability of easy credit nowadays. But, our definition of success through meritocracy should be changed, and not be so skewed towards monetary attainment and using it as the only critical yardstick when measuring success in Singapore.

 

Easier said than done though, as mentalities can only be changed after a few generations.

 

Only through adversities where one learns faster and picks up. In the world where survival is important in the sense, getting a roof which probably cost you a few hundred k , money is one of the essential yardsticks to life. Work life balance is only for people which can afford them. Once one has enough money , it is his/her choice whether if she intends to continue to purse material needs or should they choose something else like family or interests.

[Hydrocarbon]

  On 7/19/2013 at 1:07 AM, CH_CO said:

Thus the mentality that you are rich so you are expected to do more and if you don't the same negativeness would be amplify in the same way. Greed and jealousy is always there , some would claim others Hao Lian when they expose their wealth while other will try to be you in various ways. It is easy to share what you don't need but it is less easy for you to share something neccessary .

 

While it is easy to be self centered but how many here can claim he is truly selfless ? Would you share the fruits of success with one which did nothing during your struggles and continue to do nothing when they are supposed to?

 

Have you seen the video?

 

It's not about expecting the rich to do more. It's about how wealth affects the mind. I think you might have either gotten the message wrong, or haven't watched the video in its entirety.

 

After reading through the rest of the comments, I really hope this thread doesn't become a bashing thread or clash of the egos again, like the other thread about Singaporean workers mentality. It's just a video done by researchers that shows how people's perception of reality changes when they are given advantages over others. Similar to another research that shows how people's perception of themselves change after some posture changes.

[CH_CO]

  On 7/19/2013 at 11:02 AM, Hydrocarbon said:

Have you seen the video?

 

It's not about expecting the rich to do more. It's about how wealth affects the mind. I think you might have either gotten the message wrong, or haven't watched the video in its entirety.

 

After reading through the rest of the comments, I really hope this thread doesn't become a bashing thread or clash of the egos again, like the other thread about Singaporean workers mentality. It's just a video done by researchers that shows how people's perception of reality changes when they are given advantages over others. Similar to another research that shows how people's perception of themselves change after some posture changes.

 

Nope i am not , i have seen the video before and i know what it is going on. It only reflects how the "rich" makes use of the opportunities to their own advantage , regardless whether what the items are meant for. It might be wrong taking advantage like that but that is how the world goes. Survival of the fittest , this is also shown in the animal world where opportunist makes use of every opportunity to "survive" , an example a pack of hyenas waiting for a lion to kill before chasing them away or vice versa . It is just the matter of whether if this person intends to give back or not. Karma will find its way in one way or another.

 

This video fundamentally reflects an integrity issue rather than merely only the difference between rich and poor. If you put a Singaporeans vs another country which is somewhat poorer or even against US , chances are you might see differences as well. We are known to be more law abiding .

Edited July 19, 2013 by CH_CO

[Throttle2]

  On 7/18/2013 at 6:16 PM, Thaiyotakamli said:

and luckily u didnt turn bad with so many millions after wiping tables for years

 

nicely said, $ is the root of all evil and these evil think $ can buy everything. To them $ is power

 

 

 

 

 

but hor dont u think being rich even going down from expensive car, walk normal, people see it as c0cky action? just because he get down from an expensive car.

So sometimes the rich is being abused hahaha

 

I dont hv millions leh.....

 

 

[CH_CO]

  On 7/19/2013 at 12:25 PM, Throttle2 said:

I dont hv millions leh.....

 

ya , paiseh , wrong should be billions