Electric cars

[inlinesix]

On 3/7/2024 at 7:26 PM, Voodooman said:

The EV road tax, determined by power (kW) needs to be updated as well.

updated to?

[Voodooman]

On 3/7/2024 at 7:11 PM, Lala81 said:

You would need a lot of charging lots for me to be satisfied that people won't hog the EV parking lots due to charging Behaviour. Unless u say the EV charging lots are the least favorite lots of the whole block. 

My estate is outdoor parking and  has a good portion of retirees. These people can move their cars different times of the day just to make sure it's in the shade at different times of the day. Lol. 

Well maybe in 2030s, I think the infrastructure will be there bah. 

 

This is coming. Charge+ is one of thebiggest players here.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/watch/ev-charging-company-fine-users-overstaying-busy-locations-4148331

With EV range in excess of 500km and rising,  most people will just need to juice up once every 1-2 weeks. With multiple charging bays and penalties to stop hogging, it is really not a big issue for drivers with access to charging facilities both at home and at work. 

But I do foresee some teething issues, so i also won't switch is i don't have at least 2 charging options

[Beregond]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:02 PM, Voodooman said:

This is coming. Charge+ is one of thebiggest players here.

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/watch/ev-charging-company-fine-users-overstaying-busy-locations-4148331

With EV range in excess of 500km and rising,  most people will just need to juice up once every 1-2 weeks. With multiple charging bays and penalties to stop hogging, it is really not a big issue for drivers with access to charging facilities both at home and at work. 

But I do foresee some teething issues, so i also won't switch is i don't have at least 2 charging options

This is the biggest misconceptions. 

Why do ppl think that if u buy a EV. U need  to charge every day? Its very weird. Newer EV have better range then alot of ice. But how many time we pump petrol per week?

And another even bigger misconceptions , why do ppl believe the authority will let driver hog the charging station forever?

Many way to prevent that. 

But of course our equipment now is not enough to cater if every 1 go EV at once. 

It's a 10 -20 years process. 

[RadX]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:09 PM, Beregond said:

This is the biggest misconceptions. 

Why do ppl think that if u buy a EV. U need  to charge every day? Its very weird. Newer EV have better range then alot of ice. But how many time we pump petrol per week?

And another even bigger misconceptions , why do ppl believe the authority will let driver hog the charging station forever?

Many way to prevent that. 

But of course our equipment now is not enough to cater if every 1 go EV at once. 

It's a 10 -20 years process. 

Correct

 

by that time I be 

 

End

Variant

 

liao😂

[Mkl22]

On 3/7/2024 at 11:45 AM, Vratenza said:

Yeah, that's why I am trying to highlight the practical considerations of owning a hybrid when the media seem to be just pointing towards hybrid as the only way to go in the era of faltering EVs and the need to achieve emission control.

Benefits of having 2 systems in one car have to be prepared for the issues of the 2 systems combined. That is all I am saying.

Maybe the big cc gs450h is more complex. But excellent reliability from the 1.8 hybrids. Talk to any Prius Noah PHV. Easily 500-600k km. Only persistent problem is the ABS pump and master cylinder which fails around 300k km

[Lala81]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:09 PM, Beregond said:

But of course our equipment now is not enough to cater if every 1 go EV at once. 

It's a 10 -20 years process. 

Now >90+% of singapore parking lots have no EV charging. Let's just say maybe a modest 20-30% lots will need some form of charging in the eventuality. 

That's what? Maybe 100k chargers cao cao. 

The bluesg or getgo etc will have their own cars that need charging. So u can eliminate most of their chargers other than off peak periods. 

How are they going to decide when to keep building more EV charging lots? Of course 1 way is scheduled building. We build some for every place, especially new buildings or hdb MSCP. 

Then later on, it surely must be demand based.

For eg. AMK hub has few hundred parking lots. And about 3 or 4 chargers? 

How will the company decide if amk hub is where I'm going to get the fastest ROI? After all companies are all come down to where I can get ROI. 

I will put it only in places I have sure  demand ie places which are close to max utilization. This set of carparks have like very high utility. Eg there's >80-90% utilization. Let's build more there.

But do u want to be the guy looking out for charging lots when this process is happening? It could be minimum 1 year or even years before they get to solving the problem for you. Cos remember u are unlikely to change your charging location. You are either at work, at home or running errands in those few places. 

 

Not saying that anti hogging practices won't come in. But it's one more thing u need to keep track of everyday lor. 

Its like some people like to wear smartwatch. But need to charge it everynight. U ask them issit troublesome. They say no. But some people just like to change their Casio quartz watch battery every two years lor. 

Edited March 7, 2024 by Lala81

[thebestbees]

@inlinesix that’s going green for you. Not adding those “ flat rate allowance “ like in sg for “ loss of petrol taxes “ 

[Vratenza]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:09 PM, Beregond said:

This is the biggest misconceptions. 

Why do ppl think that if u buy a EV. U need  to charge every day? Its very weird. Newer EV have better range then alot of ice. But how many time we pump petrol per week?

And another even bigger misconceptions , why do ppl believe the authority will let driver hog the charging station forever?

Many way to prevent that. 

But of course our equipment now is not enough to cater if every 1 go EV at once. 

It's a 10 -20 years process. 

I think the problem is as of now the advertised range is still way longer than real world range ( tonnes of videos from real owners of teslas and MIC EVs from US/UK/China complaining of the oversold range). 

Also the problem with lithium battery is that to optimize the battery health, there is a range of charge to keep the charge at and definitely not desirable for the battery charge to run down to <5% or be topped up fully to 100%.

Combine all these with the fact that unless you have your own personal charger to charge it as and when at the comfort of your home without the worry of having to shift your car from a public charger, the stress of making sure ur car is charged optimally and has the juice and range prepared for your next day's usage is something I rather do without. 

I really applaud the owners of the Tesla Y and Ionic 5 in my condo that do not have any EV charger at all. 

Edited March 7, 2024 by Vratenza

[Vratenza]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:39 PM, Lala81 said:

Now >90+% of singapore parking lots have no EV charging. Let's just say maybe a modest 20-30% lots will need some form of charging in the eventuality. 

That's what? Maybe 100k chargers cao cao. 

The bluesg or getgo etc will have their own cars that need charging. So u can eliminate most of their chargers other than off peak periods. 

How are they going to decide when to keep building more EV charging lots? Of course 1 way is scheduled building. We build some for every place, especially new buildings or hdb MSCP. 

Then later on, it surely must be demand based.

For eg. AMK hub has few hundred parking lots. And about 3 or 4 chargers? 

How will the company decide if amk hub is where I'm going to get the fastest ROI? After all companies are all come down to where I can get ROI. 

I will put it only in places I have sure  demand ie places which are close to max utilization. This set of carparks have like very high utility. Eg there's >80-90% utilization. Let's build more there.

But do u want to be the guy looking out for charging lots when this process is happening? It could be minimum 1 year or even years before they get to solving the problem for you. Cos remember u are unlikely to change your charging location. You are either at work, at home or running errands in those few places. 

 

Not saying that anti hogging practices won't come in. But it's one more thing u need to keep track of everyday lor. 

Its like some people like to wear smartwatch. But need to charge it everynight. U ask them issit troublesome. They say no. But some people just like to change their Casio quartz watch battery every two years lor. 

I prefer casio tough solar..... Never change batteries for years... 😁

[Lala81]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:58 PM, Vratenza said:

I prefer casio tough solar..... Never change batteries for years... 😁

Just personality bah. I'm sure we know our own Kuan. 

1 type is every item on their checklist must be checked off in sequence. 1 type is comfortable with lot of different stuff on their plate. Happy go lucky. 

I'm more to the former, cannot stand it if something is not done. Like if need to check in at airport for a flight. I feel mild irritation until I'm sure it's settled. 

So why bother to add some minor crap like my car charging cable need to be disconnected at my lunch time ?

If just everyday come home. Connect then wake up next morning, disconnect and be on your way. I also don't mind. 

[Kklee]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:54 PM, Vratenza said:

I think the problem is as of now the advertised range is still way longer than real world range ( tonnes of videos from real owners of teslas and MIC EVs from US/UK/China complaining of the oversold range). 

Also the problem with lithium battery is that to optimize the battery health, there is a range of charge to keep the charge at and definitely not desirable for the battery charge to run down to <5% or be topped up fully to 100%.

Combine all these with the fact that unless you have your own personal charger to charge it as and when at the comfort of your home without the worry of having to shift your car from a public charger, the stress of making sure ur car is charged optimally and has the juice and range prepared for your next day's usage is something I rather do without. 

I really applaud the owners of the Tesla Y and Ionic 5 in my condo that do not have any EV charger at all. 

IMHO.
My hybrid,  the battery already small.  The battery indicator total 8 bars.  Lower limit is 3 bars. Upper limit is 2 bars.  All I get to use is 3 bars in between.  🤣

[Kklee]

On 3/7/2024 at 8:31 PM, Mkl22 said:

Maybe the big cc gs450h is more complex. But excellent reliability from the 1.8 hybrids. Talk to any Prius Noah PHV. Easily 500-600k km. Only persistent problem is the ABS pump and master cylinder which fails around 300k km

IMHO.
Toyota Corolla Cross Hybrid 2.0 based on last 3 tanks, full tank calculated to be between 932-1018 km.  This model is rated to be NOT fuel efficient. 

[Vratenza]

On 3/7/2024 at 9:46 PM, Kklee said:

IMHO.
My hybrid,  the battery already small.  The battery indicator total 8 bars.  Lower limit is 3 bars. Upper limit is 2 bars.  All I get to use is 3 bars in between.  🤣

Hybrid is different.

Hybrid has the petrol engine to switch over everytime the battery management system wants the battery to charge back up to a certain level. .

My hybrid last time, Most of the time, the system priority is to maintain the battery near 3/4 mark and i rarely see full charge unless i am going down a long stretch of highway cruising in comfort mode. On the other extreme, the only time my battery level goes empty and flashed red is when i put to sports mode and just wot like crazy for an empty section of NSHW. 

For BEV, the only regen comes from the brakes and no alternative power source to play tag team.

[Kklee]

On 3/7/2024 at 10:00 PM, Vratenza said:

Hybrid is different.

Hybrid has the petrol engine to switch over everytime the battery management system wants the battery to charge back up to a certain level. .

My hybrid last time, Most of the time, the system priority is to maintain the battery near 3/4 mark and i rarely see full charge unless i am going down a long stretch of highway cruising in comfort mode. On the other extreme, the only time my battery level goes empty and flashed red is when i put to sports mode and just wot like crazy for an empty section of NSHW. 

For BEV, the only regen comes from the brakes and no alternative power source to play tag team.

IMHO.
And this is the scenario that affects the most - cold start in the morning, the battery needs to be charged but the engine is cold and the Atkinson cycle engine lack power at lower rpm - engine a bit rough. 

Must try the WOT to see the battery indicator.  🤣  My experience is after a bit of spirited driving, will max my battery level.  🤔

[inlinesix]

On 3/7/2024 at 10:11 PM, Kklee said:

IMHO.
And this is the scenario that affects the most - cold start in the morning, the battery needs to be charged but the engine is cold and the Atkinson cycle engine lack power at lower rpm - engine a bit rough. 

Must try the WOT to see the battery indicator.  🤣  My experience is after a bit of spirited driving, will max my battery level.  🤔

Why your battery below threshold at night?
 

[Kklee]

On 3/7/2024 at 10:21 PM, inlinesix said:

Why your battery below threshold at night?
 

IMHO.
The battery not necessary will be below the threshold.  After cold start,  the vehicle can move off using battery and after awhile, the cold engine will kick in to charge the battery.  

[Eastmaner]

https://www.cer-rec.gc.ca/en/data-analysis/energy-markets/market-snapshots/2021/market-snapshot-plug-in-hybrid-vehicles-are-far-more-fuel-efficient-over-short-trips-than-long-trips.html
 

interesting study done in Canada comparing the fuel efficiency of hybrid vs plug in hybrid vs ev.

i was looking at plug in hybrid as an option vs ev but as someone mentioned earlier, the rationale behind having both electric and ice systems may become a nightmare later when it comes to servicing. Thus, the logical thing to do is to jump straight into EV. However, not sure about the lack of maintenance requirements of EVs. Seems so that most EVs ( except tesla) still stick to a service schedule similar to an ICE car. Nissan and Lexus, for example, still have a half yearly maintenance requirement. Not sure about others. Remains to be seen how much less maintenance will an EV be. 

Edited March 7, 2024 by Eastmaner

[Calinlin]

For those that installed a charger at home, did you pull electricity from the main outside and install another circuit breaker box? Or did you have to pull the wire from the existing circuit breaker box in the house?