Poll --- No More COE. but ERP $30 per entry.

[Kiadaw]

There is a saying, "Be careful what you wish for, for it can comes true".

 

 

[13177]

  On 1/22/2013 at 11:43 AM, Kiadaw said:

There is a saying, "Be careful what you wish for, for it can comes true".

I think only bad things can comes true. When we wish for good things, it never happen.

[Jho0001]

one major problem that I see is that they have the expressway entry and exits at the same location, so one hand you have cars trying to enter the expressway and on the other hand you haves trying to exit...go figure?

[Atonchia]

When more people buy cars where to park the cars then?

[Akula]

I stay in the East, work in the East, as such ERP hardly affects me.

 

So logically should support the abolishment of COE, BUT, that would mean everywhere else is super packed! Plus where to park/go?

 

Like it or not, COE is here to stay. Present system not perfect, can fine tune, but to do away is not advisable......

[Simplecar]

  On 1/22/2013 at 11:43 AM, Kiadaw said:

There is a saying, "Be careful what you wish for, for it can comes true".

From my observations, any complaints to the higher ups will result in unpredictable outcomes that could be unwanted.

 

Example -

(1) people complained about insufficient taxis in airports. out coms the surcharges to 'encourage' them to come.

(2) people complained about insufficient taxis in city areas. out comes increased taxi charges to 'encourage' taxis to comes, and to reduce demand for taxis, allowing those more willing, more desperate to get them easier

(3) people complained about traffic congestion along expressways. out comes road pricing ,and vehicle control

(4) now when people complain about high COEs, what will they do next?

[Kar_lover]

  On 1/23/2013 at 12:30 AM, Simplecar said:

From my observations, any complaints to the higher ups will result in unpredictable outcomes that could be unwanted.

 

Example -

(1) people complained about insufficient taxis in airports. out coms the surcharges to 'encourage' them to come.

(2) people complained about insufficient taxis in city areas. out comes increased taxi charges to 'encourage' taxis to comes, and to reduce demand for taxis, allowing those more willing, more desperate to get them easier

(3) people complained about traffic congestion along expressways. out comes road pricing ,and vehicle control

(4) now when people complain about high COEs, what will they do next?

 

The first 2 is simple econmics as you have said yourself - incentivise supply of taxi at the same time moderate the demand for taxi. The 3rd one is also similar economics but in this case supply cannot be easily and readily increased hence to reduce demand (use) of road need to price for it. This is not dissimilar to when the telcos removed the bundled 12GB data. Anything that is given "cheaply" will see abuse. All the telcos were doing was adjusting their supply curve.

 

For item 4, we'll just have to wait. Little bird told me that there will be a car loan cap of 80% after CNY. But current COE is already caused byu market forces (i.e. demand).

 

The problem why complainants find the outcome unpredictable is because they expect self-serving "solutions"/expectations without considering the big picture or the "other side". For example, for item 1, do you expect the govt to force taxi drivers to go airport (go so far just to pick up passenger) or go to town (stuck in jam just to pick up passenger)? To me surcharges are to compensate them for the distance and jam (respectively). As it is, there are already several bus services and mrt stations at the airport. If you die die want to take taxi, it's really up to you. When i was in Bali last year, i met a local who told me how much she loved Singapore. She cited how upon reaching the airport got a nice train station with nice clean trains and she just ride for awhile and enjoying some of the sights (she meant the above ground stations) and can reach orchard road!

 

 

 

 

[Simplecar]

  On 1/23/2013 at 12:54 AM, Kar_lover said:

The first 2 is simple econmics as you have said yourself - incentivise supply of taxi at the same time moderate the demand for taxi. The 3rd one is also similar economics but in this case supply cannot be easily and readily increased hence to reduce demand (use) of road need to price for it. This is not dissimilar to when the telcos removed the bundled 12GB data. Anything that is given "cheaply" will see abuse. All the telcos were doing was adjusting their supply curve.

 

For item 4, we'll just have to wait. Little bird told me that there will be a car loan cap of 80% after CNY. But current COE is already caused byu market forces (i.e. demand).

 

The problem why complainants find the outcome unpredictable is because they expect self-serving "solutions"/expectations without considering the big picture or the "other side". For example, for item 1, do you expect the govt to force taxi drivers to go airport (go so far just to pick up passenger) or go to town (stuck in jam just to pick up passenger)? To me surcharges are to compensate them for the distance and jam (respectively). As it is, there are already several bus services and mrt stations at the airport. If you die die want to take taxi, it's really up to you. When i was in Bali last year, i met a local who told me how much she loved Singapore. She cited how upon reaching the airport got a nice train station with nice clean trains and she just ride for awhile and enjoying some of the sights (she meant the above ground stations) and can reach orchard road!

I love the Train right at the doorstep!

I agree with you last paragraph especially because the big picture is seldom clear to the people who are more focussed on their own agenda.

 

[Hi_torq]

  On 1/23/2013 at 12:30 AM, Simplecar said:

From my observations, any complaints to the higher ups will result in unpredictable outcomes that could be unwanted.

 

Example -

(4) now when people complain about high COEs, what will they do next?

 

Go old Chinese way - cars only for goverment officials, foreign big shots. Rest all on bicycles

 

 

[Hi_torq]

GPS ERP!!! Simply, cover the antenna, drive free

 

No need GPS. Simply petrol price $30 a litre and parking $30 an hour (anywhere, home also including terrace house). ZERO tax, ZERO COE, ZERO ERP.

 

Drive MY car, drive SG car, no problem. MY car come to Singapore, 3/4 empty tank, fill SG petrol. No toll.

 

More choice in car models. People happy, govt. happy, car sales guy happy, SHELL CALTEX happy.

 

We guys still not happy

 

[Ezfaun]

Leave it as it is. If COE was to be abolished, we will see almost everyone buying cars. By then even old aunty cleaners can buy car. We got roughly 5 million people in sg.

 

And around 1 million vehicles. Even right now, our road density is quite packed. I can't imagine if there were 2-3 million vehicles here.

 

If that happens, the whole country will come to a standstill. I would contemplate moving to australia if that happens.

[Givechance]

  On 1/28/2013 at 7:12 AM, Ezfaun said:

Leave it as it is. If COE was to be abolished, we will see almost everyone buying cars. By then even old aunty cleaners can buy car. We got roughly 5 million people in sg.

 

And around 1 million vehicles. Even right now, our road density is quite packed. I can't imagine if there were 2-3 million vehicles here.

 

If that happens, the whole country will come to a standstill. I would contemplate moving to australia if that happens.

 

Why would the country come to a standstill? JKT and BKK got no COE. Their car population is huge, and traffic jams in the main city roads. But did that hinder their economy and desire to drive?

 

If Singapore huge traffic jams, then more will take public transport and leave their cars at home, or sell it away. It will balance out naturally, the traffic jams will reach a acceptable level naturally.

 

They way I fee about COE and the earlier ALS scheme, it's the desire of a few elites who wants the road to be clear, so that they can travel in smooth traffic, and not worried about getting stuck in traffic and waste their elitist precious time.

 

Have you guys every wondered in those early 80's with the ALS, are the roads really so jammed packed? Bearing in mind that time the vehicles population must have being so much lower than now.

Or even to the very first few years of COE implementation, was the vehicular population so large that the roads were always jammed packed like now?

Edited January 28, 2013 by Givechance

[Ezfaun]

  On 1/28/2013 at 7:23 AM, Givechance said:

Why would the country come to a standstill? JKT and BKK got no COE. Their car population is huge, and traffic jams in the main city roads. But did that hinder their economy and desire to drive?

 

If Singapore huge traffic jams, then more will take public transport and leave their cars at home, or sell it away. It will balance out naturally, the traffic jams will reach a acceptable level naturally.

 

They way I fee about COE and the earlier ALS scheme, it's the desire of a few elites who wants the road to be clear, so that they can travel in smooth traffic, and not worried about getting stuck in traffic and waste their elitist precious time.

 

Have you guys every wondered in those early 80's with the ALS, are the roads really so jammed packed? Bearing in mind that time the vehicles population must have being so much lower than now.

Or even to the very first few years of COE implementation, was the vehicular population so large that the roads were always jammed packed like now?

 

It will come to a standstill based on road density and traffic jams. Plus, a lot of people will try to avoid the erp and take other routes of travelling. That means that there will be jam everywhere. Bad idea.

[Lava]

COE is still the best tool to control veh population.

 

If without COE, my grand parents will say they need a car to go play majong.

my parents will say they need a car to go visiting, my children will say they

need a car to go to school.

[Simplecar]

  On 1/28/2013 at 6:01 AM, Hi_torq said:

Go old Chinese way - cars only for goverment officials, foreign big shots. Rest all on bicycles

So we have lots of 'govt officials' here since so many have cars. :)