Merc E230(W211) or BMW 525i(E60)?

[Skanps]

No $$ to buy new model so considering old model. Both are 2,500cc.

 

2007-08 models for both are similarly priced. Would you choose E230(W211) with V6 or BMW 525i(E60) with IL6? Why?

 

I've test driven some time ago a C230 (same engine as E230), and a 325i(same engine as 525i) and my impression (if memory serves me correctly) is that the IL6 for the 325 is more willing to rev, more responsive. Creamy smooth mated to its 6-speed gearbox. It also seems that 325i has much better sound insulation which I can hardly hear any enging noise most of the time. I've no idea about the gear system of the Merc but the engine noise of the V6 in the C230 is much more intruding to the drive cabin perhaps due to sound insulation? The engine note is also much sweeter for the 325i while that for the C230 is more coarse. Shouldn't Merc be very good at V6 as IL6 to BMW?

 

Besides engine, what other consideration you have?

 

Care to share?

 

Cheers!

 

[Cerano]

I actually think that the IL6 sounds better than the Mercedes's V6 in terms of sportyness.

However, the W211's SP is actually much much better than the W203 (C230) 's soundproofing.

 

From my experience the Mercedes V6 is smoother and less whiny than the Il6 but the IL6 sounds more gritty and sporty.

 

In terms of comfort an E230 would be much more comfortable than the 525i for sure!

 

A 2008 E230 W211 would be a FL model and as such would have quite few reliability issues. The 525i E60 on the other hand is....... quite problematic

 

Please let me know if you have any more questions

 

Cheers

[Chickenbackside]

W204 vs E90 and W211 vs E60 is very different.

 

W211 definitely feels more old school than the E60, but not in a bad way. It rides smoother and feels more traditionally luxurious. Interior and boot space is better in the W211 as well.

 

However, if driver involvement is an important factor, skip the Merc. But don't underestimate the W211's ability to handle. Sure, the steering feel isn't as great as the E60's, but it is by no means bad.

 

If you value reliability, then choose the FL W211. The problems have pretty much been ironed out. Well, maybe the 7Gtronic gearbox of E230's has a bad rep, but the E60's gearbox isn't any better from what i have gathered.

[Throttle2]

I actually think that the IL6 sounds better than the Mercedes's V6 in terms of sportyness.

However, the W211's SP is actually much much better than the W203 (C230) 's soundproofing.

 

From my experience the Mercedes V6 is smoother and less whiny than the Il6 but the IL6 sounds more gritty and sporty.

 

In terms of comfort an E230 would be much more comfortable than the 525i for sure!

 

A 2008 E230 W211 would be a FL model and as such would have quite few reliability issues. The 525i E60 on the other hand is....... quite problematic

 

Please let me know if you have any more questions

 

Cheers

 

 

I never owned the E230 but was considering it as a family car.

So I cant comment.

 

But I've owned the 525i E60 and it is problem free, just regular maintenance.

In fact I've owned 3 BMWs til date, all no problems, all secondhand, so I cant understand it when people say BMW is problematic.

 

Maybe I'm super lucky...haha

 

[Cerano]

I never owned the E230 but was considering it as a family car.

So I cant comment.

 

But I've owned the 525i E60 and it is problem free, just regular maintenance.

In fact I've owned 3 BMWs til date, all no problems, all secondhand, so I cant understand it when people say BMW is problematic.

 

Maybe I'm super lucky...haha

 

 

you super lucky la

 

my friend's 523i always park outside end up the whole interior all chipping up plus the locking system got many issues

[Throttle2]

you super lucky la

 

my friend's 523i always park outside end up the whole interior all chipping up plus the locking system got many issues

 

wahh so koyak....time to change from BMW to Mercy....yeah...

 

haha

[Okitri]

wow., suzuki-s concept car info is here...

 

check it now at http://autocarpedia.com/review-suzuki-s-concept.html :D

[Skanps]

Thanks for the input. You mention that 2008 W211 E230 is FL. May I know what has been changed for the FL? When exactly was the FL?

 

Besides can't afford a new E class, actually I like the look of the W211 (I'm old school.. ) more and I like the fact that any problem with W211 would have been fully ironed out with 2007/2008 model whenW211 was reaching its EOL. Moreover, I still somehow feel that it is money better spent on a 6pot NA rather than 4pot TC if one is after power with refinement. Perhaps I haven't tried the latest TC/SC enough.

 

By the way, the MMI of W211 E230 seems much plain compare to the W204 Class, right? At least there's no COMMAND yet with any W211 right?

 

[Skanps]

W204 vs E90 and W211 vs E60 is very different.

 

W211 definitely feels more old school than the E60, but not in a bad way. It rides smoother and feels more traditionally luxurious. Interior and boot space is better in the W211 as well.

 

However, if driver involvement is an important factor, skip the Merc. But don't underestimate the W211's ability to handle. Sure, the steering feel isn't as great as the E60's, but it is by no means bad.

 

If you value reliability, then choose the FL W211. The problems have pretty much been ironed out. Well, maybe the 7Gtronic gearbox of E230's has a bad rep, but the E60's gearbox isn't any better from what i have gathered.

 

 

The 7Gtronic gearbox has a bad rep? Sorry, I'm a frog under the well....why's that so?

 

For E60 gearbox, I do notice when I test drove the 325i that the first 1-2 gears can be a little jerky (moving from still). Beyond that, it was creamy smooth.

[Cerano]

Thanks for the input. You mention that 2008 W211 E230 is FL. May I know what has been changed for the FL? When exactly was the FL?

 

Besides can't afford a new E class, actually I like the look of the W211 (I'm old school.. ) more and I like the fact that any problem with W211 would have been fully ironed out with 2007/2008 model whenW211 was reaching its EOL. Moreover, I still somehow feel that it is money better spent on a 6pot NA rather than 4pot TC if one is after power with refinement. Perhaps I haven't tried the latest TC/SC enough.

 

By the way, the MMI of W211 E230 seems much plain compare to the W204 Class, right? At least there's no COMMAND yet with any W211 right?

 

For the FL,

 

some of the internal fittings (electrical systems eg. switches) were changed and updated as well as the outer facade (eg. bumper). Correct the later production units in 2007,08 dont have many issues. Personally I drive a 4pot SC and it gives a rather brutish pull similar to what you'd feel in a gti/sonata not so much the calm steadyness of a V6. The Mercedes M272 V6 is actually well known for its refinement and creamy-smoothness.

 

The COMAND (The germans very funny only use one M i know) for W211 is of a totally different generation from the W204 la brudder. The W204 one is of the same generation as the W212, W207 which are slightly more advanced than the W221's which is still 1 generation ahead of the W211's but if you're interested I can do it for you too but its rather costly as compared to a W204 or W212 or W207 and furthermore map updates they dont really do them anymore for W211 but the features in it are good to have la. We can always talk about this after you get your car so dont worry about it for now.

 

Since you referred to it as MMI i figure you must be from an Audi background

 

In Mercs, we have the standard stock Audio 20 system which is the regular one (COMAND is very rare in Singapore) with a small colour screen and is usually capable of only radio and bt telephony, on the pre-FL W211s, an older version of the Audio 20 is factory fitted and its a dot-matrix display system just like in hifi systems but in the FL late production units, a proper Audio 20 with full colour LCD is provided.

 

Let me know if you need more help, I can help you with a personalised report on the car if you require it.

 

Lastly whichever car you choose make sure you send it for a good ol' inspection

Edited March 18, 2011 by Cerano

[Cerano]

The 7Gtronic gearbox has a bad rep? Sorry, I'm a frog under the well....why's that so?

 

For E60 gearbox, I do notice when I test drove the 325i that the first 1-2 gears can be a little jerky (moving from still). Beyond that, it was creamy smooth.

 

7 g tronic used to be famous for its tendency to break down in the long term

[Skanps]

For the FL,

 

some of the internal fittings (electrical systems eg. switches) were changed and updated as well as the outer facade (eg. bumper). Correct the later production units in 2007,08 dont have many issues. Personally I drive a 4pot SC and it gives a rather brutish pull similar to what you'd feel in a gti/sonata not so much the calm steadyness of a V6. The Mercedes M272 V6 is actually well known for its refinement and creamy-smoothness.

 

The COMAND (The germans very funny only use one M i know) for W211 is of a totally different generation from the W204 la brudder. The W204 one is of the same generation as the W212, W207 which are slightly more advanced than the W221's which is still 1 generation ahead of the W211's but if you're interested I can do it for you too but its rather costly as compared to a W204 or W212 or W207 and furthermore map updates they dont really do them anymore for W211 but the features in it are good to have la. We can always talk about this after you get your car so dont worry about it for now.

 

Since you referred to it as MMI i figure you must be from an Audi background

 

In Mercs, we have the standard stock Audio 20 system which is the regular one (COMAND is very rare in Singapore) with a small colour screen and is usually capable of only radio and bt telephony, on the pre-FL W211s, an older version of the Audio 20 is factory fitted and its a dot-matrix display system just like in hifi systems but in the FL late production units, a proper Audio 20 with full colour LCD is provided.

 

Let me know if you need more help, I can help you with a personalised report on the car if you require it.

 

Lastly whichever car you choose make sure you send it for a good ol' inspection

 

Thanks bro Cerano for the prompt sharing. Nope, I''m not driving an Audi (naturally, cause I prefer displacement over SC/TC and if I could afford an Audi, I would've gotten myself the BMW IL6 or Merc V6 instead already lah. ). I mention MMI cause I heard my car hifi installer mentioning MML when I upgrade the hifi system of my Jap car.

 

 

If I'm to get a Merc, I think I'll try to get it through Republic. Since they already have in-house 33pts check, do they still allow us to drive it to our own workshop for further inspection? And since they're C&C sister company, what they mention about the used car should be reliable right? Or I should ask bro Throttle2 for a contact of his used car dealer when he has been having a good supply of trouble free used cars (just kidding)

 

Actually I don't fancy much on the MML and for conti, don't think I'll try to mess with upgrading the audio system - so long it has a decent sound system with built in blue tooth and reverse camera which are rather basic nowaday.....oh, so the pre-FL old dot matrix disply dont have reverse camera function compare to the post-FL colour LCD one?

 

Cheers!

 

 

[Cerano]

Thanks bro Cerano for the prompt sharing. Nope, I''m not driving an Audi (naturally, cause I prefer displacement over SC/TC and if I could afford an Audi, I would've gotten myself the BMW IL6 or Merc V6 instead already lah. ). I mention MMI cause I heard my car hifi installer mentioning MML when I upgrade the hifi system of my Jap car.

 

 

If I'm to get a Merc, I think I'll try to get it through Republic. Since they already have in-house 33pts check, do they still allow us to drive it to our own workshop for further inspection? And since they're C&C sister company, what they mention about the used car should be reliable right? Or I should ask bro Throttle2 for a contact of his used car dealer when he has been having a good supply of trouble free used cars (just kidding)

 

Actually I don't fancy much on the MML and for conti, don't think I'll try to mess with upgrading the audio system - so long it has a decent sound system with built in blue tooth and reverse camera which are rather basic nowaday.....oh, so the pre-FL old dot matrix disply dont have reverse camera function compare to the post-FL colour LCD one?

 

Cheers!

 

even the FL Audio 20 also dont have reverse camera and may or may not have bluetooth!

 

you used to play ice ah? haha actually i only help bros with OEM factory system upgrades so no aftermarket stuff around

 

on a more serious note,

im not quite sure if you'll get a good price within republic auto though but be sure to squeeze them dry!

Edited March 19, 2011 by Cerano

[Kar_lover]

 

For me its E60. Merc too "uncker" (no offence).

[Chickenbackside]

Most post 2008 CnC W211's would have an after market reverse cam installed. The screen is very small and it's mounted on the right hand side of the rear view mirror. No where near as functional as original ones with distance markings and all that, but functional enough to see what's behind your bumper.

[East539]

even the FL Audio 20 also dont have reverse camera and may or may not have bluetooth!

 

you used to play ice ah? haha actually i only help bros with OEM factory system upgrades so no aftermarket stuff around

 

on a more serious note,

im not quite sure if you'll get a good price within republic auto though but be sure to squeeze them dry!

 

ya bro, from what i have observed even those 1st batch FL W211 were equip with dot matrix Audio 20 system, no BT & reverse cam & only until mid 08 or later than AD equip with the full color lcd Audio 20 system with BT but for the reverse cam, not all have it, so a good bet would be to reccee for one after july 2008.

[Cerano]

ya bro, from what i have observed even those 1st batch FL W211 were equip with dot matrix Audio 20 system, no BT & reverse cam & only until mid 08 or later than AD equip with the full color lcd Audio 20 system with BT but for the reverse cam, not all have it, so a good bet would be to reccee for one after july 2008.

 

yup very hard to tell can only see from their product date. July 2008 is also when they revised some of the other internals inside

[Cerano]

Most post 2008 CnC W211's would have an after market reverse cam installed. The screen is very small and it's mounted on the right hand side of the rear view mirror. No where near as functional as original ones with distance markings and all that, but functional enough to see what's behind your bumper.

 

CNC one is installed by a 3rd party called tomo leather.

 

very low quality and its a pal camera