Punishment too light?

[Greatbirdlegend]

In this case, the accused was found negligent by the judge, was he not?

 

In that case, normally speaking, sentence should be a fine. So what aggravating circumstances justify an exceptional sentence of imprisonment?

 

In fact, there are mitigating factors here. First time offender, pleaded guilty and relatively young age. All of which justify a lower sentence.

 

True on the mitigating factors.

Except here an innocent woman in her prime was killed.

I would consider a death aggravating enough.

 

See?

We can agree to disagree without resorting to childish insults.

[TandemAssassin]

There's no need to get personal.

It reflects badly on yourself.

I thought we were having an adult discussion here?

 

I am not getting personal.

 

In fact you seem very interested in our courts' sentencing practices. Hence, I was suggesting you should read up further on it.

[TandemAssassin]

True on the mitigating factors.

Except here an innocent woman in her prime was killed.

I would consider a death aggravating enough.

 

See?

We can agree to disagree without resorting to childish insults.

 

Except that death is not an aggravating factor. It is an essential element of the charge.

 

I never intended to insult you. I was imploring you to read up more on Criminal Law. If you misunderstood, I apologize.

[Greatbirdlegend]

I am not getting personal.

 

In fact you seem very interested in our courts' sentencing practices. Hence, I was suggesting you should read up further on it.

 

You sure have a way with words.

 

"Please please have some basic understanding of Criminal Law in SG before shooting your mouth of."

[XALmoN]

YES.

 

It is also part of your duty to avoid. You feel that this thing is unavoidable.

 

And given how taxi drivers drive, tailgating, not signaling to change lanes and not giving way,

 

Who's to say that this accident was not a result of

 

1. Lorry guy illegal lane change

AND

2. Cabby's failure to give way

 

Once again, it IS your duty to try an avoid accidents to the best of your ability, if somebody die die want to cut in, let it be. Singaporeans DO NOT ever give way, and will even purposefully fill the gap to prevent a car from filling up the space in front.

 

I do admit there is some sort of assumption here, but who's to know? Do you know the exact sequence of events? Or are you just going on one detail; the p plater crossed double white lines. Its hardly a capital offense.

 

The judgment is sound, the guy is a new driver, his punishment seems fair enough. He has learnt more than jail can ever teach him, the sense of guilt and what not has probably punished him enough. There is consideration taken for all these things, and also depending on his attitude there and then, the judge may deem that he is truly repentent and thus a lighter sentence.

 

And furthermore, if you're not satisfied that he has received adequate punishment.

 

Think about his insurance in future, who's gonna want to insure his car? How much are the premiums and excess going to be? The prices are cut throat now, and with his bad record, its gonna be insane.

 

Think about it, this casualty is part of an unintended consequence. Who wishes for accidents to happen?

 

The guy has received sufficient punishment, but there is no sufficient recompense for the girl's family, even a few million dollars won't bring back the dead. And even if the guy is hung, or put in jail for a few years, all you get is either 1 more life lost, or a few years of taxpayers money going towards feeding this dude.

 

And maybe, if you feel this accident is unavoidable, please open your eyes. And brake before you horn.

Edited October 20, 2010 by XALmoN

[Greatbirdlegend]

Except that death is not an aggravating factor. It is an essential element of the charge.

 

I never intended to insult you. I was imploring you to read up more on Criminal Law. If you misunderstood, I apologize.

 

No apologies needed.

I'm sure I'm not familiar with how the internet talk works.

[Timex1441]

"...He has learnt more than jail can ever teach him, the sense of guilt and what not has probably punished him enough..."

 

i'm not convinced of this. There are some ppl in this world who care far more about themselves than anyone else.

If he's really regretful, then he should go and support the dead girl's parents/family financially for the rest of his life.

[XALmoN]

"...He has learnt more than jail can ever teach him, the sense of guilt and what not has probably punished him enough..."

 

i'm not convinced of this. There are some ppl in this world who care far more about themselves than anyone else.

If he's really regretful, then he should go and support the dead girl's parents/family financially for the rest of his life.

 

Then your life will probably be hell too, so cynical for what?

 

Let me talk about my only serious accident again, when that old lady rear ended my car, the first thing i thought of was.

 

1. Wah heng she's alright.

 

Then..

 

2. Wah heng in front nobody crossing road.

 

Then,

 

3. Yay, twin turbo.

 

I always put myself in other people's shoes. Give the guy a break, he's young, he's new, confirm scared shitless one.

[Joseph22]

Criminal Law in Malaysia and Singapore by Prof Tan Yock Lin

Subordinate Courts Sentencing Practice 2003

 

 

thanks.

[Joseph22]

2. Cabby's failure to give way

 

 

Even if the Cabby fail to give way. the lorry shouldn't in anyway cut in.

[Timex1441]

Then your life will probably be hell too, so cynical for what?

 

Let me talk about my only serious accident again, when that old lady rear ended my car, the first thing i thought of was.

 

1. Wah heng she's alright.

 

Then..

 

2. Wah heng in front nobody crossing road.

 

Then,

 

3. Yay, twin turbo.

 

I always put myself in other people's shoes. Give the guy a break, he's young, he's new, confirm scared shitless one.

 

Well, then tat lorry driver should put himself in the dead girl's shoes, and start contributing to her family!

[Lammy84]

Not sure why you are bringing up the speeding or sin stuff since we are not discussing these.

As in no relevance to this discussion.

We are talking about a deterrence sentence for a negligent act leading to a innocent death.

I think you still don't understand the purpose of the laws and punishment as deterrence instead of total elimination.

 

Not sure? Or paisay to admit? I talk in more easy english ok? All of you people who kbkb about punishment light dont understand 2 point

 

1. All of you who kbkb also commited these offenses 1 way or another before. U all lucky u didnt kill someone and he suay he kill someone.

If u are the 1 tt killed the girl and kena sentence to fine + dirivng ban, will u all beg the judge to jail u?

If not then mai kb la.

 

2. Deterence, even if u hang the bloody guy, it will not serve as any major deterence. Beause like the Honda Tortoise avatar guy said.

His act is ONLY neligence, killing someone is an extremely unfortunate byproduct. People will still continue to cross dbl white lines or not stop at stop line no matter if u

hang him, shoot him, kill his whole family etc. So what deterence is there?

 

Because to me, all the people crying for his blood are all just hypocrites who like watching others suffer. Don't pretend to bring up how the girls family

is gonna suffer tts y need greater punishment. You have no f***ing right bringing them up.

 

You guys just want blood because its so damn easy to sit on high horse and throw stones when the guy being stoned isnt YOU.

Pui.

[Greatbirdlegend]

Not sure? Or paisay to admit? I talk in more easy english ok? All of you people who kbkb about punishment light dont understand 2 point

 

1. All of you who kbkb also commited these offenses 1 way or another before. U all lucky u didnt kill someone and he suay he kill someone.

If u are the 1 tt killed the girl and kena sentence to fine + dirivng ban, will u all beg the judge to jail u?

If not then mai kb la.

 

2. Deterence, even if u hang the bloody guy, it will not serve as any major deterence. Beause like the Honda Tortoise avatar guy said.

His act is ONLY neligence, killing someone is an extremely unfortunate byproduct. People will still continue to cross dbl white lines or not stop at stop line no matter if u

hang him, shoot him, kill his whole family etc. So what deterence is there?

 

Because to me, all the people crying for his blood are all just hypocrites who like watching others suffer. Don't pretend to bring up how the girls family

is gonna suffer tts y need greater punishment. You have no f***ing right bringing them up.

 

You guys just want blood because its so damn easy to sit on high horse and throw stones when the guy being stoned isnt YOU.

Pui.

 

Wow, I'm in awe.

So brilliantly written I have no answer.

Pui to you too.

 

[Timex1441]

Not sure? Or paisay to admit? I talk in more easy english ok? All of you people who kbkb about punishment light dont understand 2 point

 

1. All of you who kbkb also commited these offenses 1 way or another before. U all lucky u didnt kill someone and he suay he kill someone.

If u are the 1 tt killed the girl and kena sentence to fine + dirivng ban, will u all beg the judge to jail u?

If not then mai kb la.

 

Many of us who committed offences did it SAFELY enough. It's not just based on luck, like u put it. AND there are some of us who DIDN'T commit offences, so dun be presumptous.

For me, if I really caused a death, I'll actually ask the judge for a heavy sentence. That's called man-up and bear responsbility.

 

2. Deterence, even if u hang the bloody guy, it will not serve as any major deterence. Beause like the Honda Tortoise avatar guy said.

His act is ONLY neligence, killing someone is an extremely unfortunate byproduct. People will still continue to cross dbl white lines or not stop at stop line no matter if u

hang him, shoot him, kill his whole family etc. So what deterence is there?

Going by ur logic, the entire justice system is useless, because every sentence handed down by the court also has no deterence effect, right?

 

Because to me, all the people crying for his blood are all just hypocrites who like watching others suffer. Don't pretend to bring up how the girls family

is gonna suffer tts y need greater punishment. You have no f***ing right bringing them up.

 

You guys just want blood because its so damn easy to sit on high horse and throw stones when the guy being stoned isnt YOU.

Pui.

 

[XALmoN]

Nonsense, an offense is an offense, there's no safely or not safely.

[Jman888]

Many of us who committed offences did it SAFELY enough. It's not just based on luck, like u put it. AND there are some of us who DIDN'T commit offences, so dun be presumptous.

For me, if I really caused a death, I'll actually ask the judge for a heavy sentence. That's called man-up and bear responsbility.

 

an offense is an offense, only if there is an accident happen....... lucky no, unlucky yes.

 

If there is a law, you ask for death sentence, the law also wont allow

 

 

 

 

[Timex1441]

Nonsense, an offense is an offense, there's no safely or not safely.

 

What i mean is, an experienced driver might cross a double-white line when the adjacent lane is empty or near empty.

True tat it's an offence but it didn't cause harm or damage to anyone.

At the end of the day, most ppl want to see justice served. And in this case, many ppl feel tat justice wasn't served, regardless of what the law says (becos there are a set of laws in the common ppl's minds, remember tat, 公道自在人心)

[Lammy84]

Ahahahan committed it SAFELY enough. Easily said until that 1 day u happen to be suay.

That lorry dude probably did it SAFELY enough the other 9 times he broke the traffic rules,

10th time suay lo.

 

See what I mean? Its not that u all never bloody commit the same offense that he did, u are all just lucky.

So u ride your lucky and stand there throwing stones on someone down on his lucky, baying for his blood.

 

To be honest, I do not care about how long the TS gets, what irked me to get involved with this thread in the first

place is the hypocrisy of people like you.

 

The deterence effect of any sentencing is always relative to the "perceived" severity of the offence.

Bringing Drugs in SG are bad, killing people are bad. If I do it, OH NOES I GET HANGED.

Therefore most normal people wont do it, it is an effective deterrant (the death sentence)

 

In the case of the lorry driver, u think if u all got what u want and he went to jail, its gonna stop others from breaking

these very same laws like double white lines?

 

Perception of "small" violations like these is that: I can do it, I just be a little bit more careful, nothing will happen la"

Jailing the guy or giving him the maximum sentence will not cause anyone to stop doing it.