Does Boost Controller really make a difference?

[Pocus]

Hi Gurus with TC cars,

 

I'm sure many of you have play with your TC engines and most probably one of the most popular device is to add a Electronic Boost Controller like HKS EVC and similar.

 

My ride is relatively stock 1.5 turbo with a stock boost of 0.6bar, I avoided putting a EVC due to warranty issues. But I would want to know if putting a EVC really make a big difference. (say configuration the EVC to allow up to 0.8bar to 1bar boost)

 

Currently, I DIYed removing a resistor pill from the solenoid allowing it to peak at 0.9bar, holding at 0.8bar boost. But maybe I'm used to the boost and didn't felt much of a difference. In fact the turbo lag seem to be slightly longer. Of perhaps removing the pill only trick the meters to boost at 0.8bar while the engine ECU is smart enough to offset the boost, hence output power is same.

 

I know boosting up the car doesn't mean the horsepower gains will be exponential and removing the solenoid pill may not be the best solution, but I'm afraid by putting back the pill and buying the EVC to set it to boost at 0.8bar will make no difference. Since mine ride is stock setup with stock muffler/stock SMIC and stock plastic dump valve, ECU, etc.

 

Any Gurus done both, both anyone here can share the difference and whether the EVC is really worth investing.

 

 

[Nmnhnlm]

If you want to add a boost controller, you may need to bypass your ECU (if its controlling the boost). Of course, there are other factors to consider when increasing the boost. But I think anything below 1 bar should be pretty safe.

[Dwoon]

The EVC's valve is stronger, so I understand. It will allow better controlof your boost and also allow high boost to be held (rather than boost tapering off at WOT)

 

That said, I only went for the boost solenoid (perrin) which is basically the valve itself. It is still controlled by the ECU. (unlike the HKS, etc which allows manipulation of the boost setting, the gain, scramble, etc) It still serves the purpose but cannot be user adjusted. Any adjustment, gotta go back to the tuner. Tuner also says its safer that I'm not allowed to fiddle with boost levels.

 

So if you want a cheaper option, go get a boost solenoid and have your ride tuned to it.

Edited January 28, 2010 by Dwoon

[Pocus]

wow thanks for your insight guys.

 

I dun intend to go beyond 1bar boost, esp with my stock components....plus the fact that unichip tuning or any piggyback can be messy if not done correctly. Heard too many horror stories. Think a full reflash would be better but more $$ involved, esp to replace the stock parts with part durable for higher boost.

 

And I didn't know they sell adjustable solenoids in the market like that, sort of like a manual boost controller you say...interesting

 

But then, any of you guys tried removing the resistor pill of your solenoid? I know not all TC cars have it but I think Mit, Nissan and Sub TC rides have it...

Just want to know the effect compared to a full-fledge Boost controller.

 

[Dwoon]

The only pill I've heard of is not in the solenoid. It is actually in the turbo wastegate's activation line/tube.

 

The restrictor removal I heard causes boost spikes (if no tuning done). The pressure in the tube will not be affected.... only the response of the wastegate actuator. (therefore the spike)

 

I've had mine removed long ago.... but then again, I have custom tune which takes care of any spikes, while giving faster actuator response.

 

 

[Sw20]

  On 1/28/2010 at 7:07 AM, Nmnhnlm said:

If you want to add a boost controller, you may need to bypass your ECU (if its controlling the boost). Of course, there are other factors to consider when increasing the boost. But I think anything below 1 bar should be pretty safe.

 

 

What he says is true.. there will be a boost cut. Your waste gate plays a part.

I have a EVC taken out of my car... It doesn't help in increasing stock boost (Depending on make).... by lowering your boost... FC is still about the same.

I wasted $400 on it...

 

 

[Pocus]

  On 1/28/2010 at 8:21 AM, Dwoon said:

The only pill I've heard of is not in the solenoid. It is actually in the turbo wastegate's activation line/tube.

 

The restrictor removal I heard causes boost spikes (if no tuning done). The pressure in the tube will not be affected.... only the response of the wastegate actuator. (therefore the spike)

 

I've had mine removed long ago.... but then again, I have custom tune which takes care of any spikes, while giving faster actuator response.

 

Oh yes that's the restrictor pill I'm talking about. I'm sorry with I sounded misleading cos for my ride, the design is in such a way the pill resides in the solenoid opening of where the tube is connected. and yes, there is spike of about .1bar but it's still ok is my stock boost is .6 nia, no CELs or such.....but after so long I really do not feel comfortable with it. That's why I thinking of EVC, at least the boost level is more stable.

 

When you mentioned custom tuning, you DIYed? Was tempted to manually adjust the actuator arm but without in-depth knowledge I made end up destroying my turbo, or worst, my engine..lol..

[Pocus]

  On 1/28/2010 at 8:44 AM, Sw20 said:

What he says is true.. there will be a boost cut. Your waste gate plays a part.

I have a EVC taken out of my car... It doesn't help in increasing stock boost (Depending on make).... by lowering your boost... FC is still about the same.

I wasted $400 on it...

 

Yeah true, got my ride I think above 1bar very proned to CEL esp with ECU not tuned.... and to buy a EVC and set it to below 1bar like very wasted....

[Dwoon]

Custom tune.... means engage a tuner who will tuned your ride ... regardless of whatever you do to it. (not those "chipping" or black box aplication where it says, stage so & so for XXX HP gains. Plug & play sorta thing)

 

Custom tune means you can ask tuner to tune for whatever you want. If you want to run 91RON.... also can.... just ask for car to be tuned to it. (but most likely cannot boost as high). You want to tune to 100 RON and above also can.... just make sure you have access to race fuel..... you can put in bigger/smaller turbo, intercooler, wastegate, throttle body, air intake, cooling mist, etc..... then have it tuned to whatever you have modified.

[Dfx16]

There's some factors that u need takenote of if u want increase boost

 

1. Fuel injectors - Can your stock injectors supply enough fuel for the extra horses

2. Fuel Pump - Can your stock fuel pump handle the extra pressure

3. After Market ECU - Required tunning to prevent car run lean

 

Suggest u get some monitor devices to monitor fuel injectors duty cycle before u increase boost on a stock setup for ex. Greddy Infometer

Ideal duty cycle @ 80% while full boost

Safe play of 20% to prevent boost spike

Edited January 28, 2010 by Dfx16

[Orixy]

Pocus: sounds like u r driving a CVR or CPT? :)

 

I have the EVC in my ride and the way it can be customised to boost according to rev (rpm) really made the boost much smoother. Without EVC, can only boost till 0.6bar (stock) and when boost comes, its rather abrupt. I set my target boost at 0.8 - 1.1 bar depending on revs.

 

If you can get a 2nd hand one, why not try the EVC. Or Blitz also not bad.

[Alechi]

tune already ... whole car feels upside down, no?

[Ruzhyo]

I use the Blitz before. From 0.6 bar I up it to 1.3bar.

 

Shiok ah! The power and accleration is great! The noise from the BOV is WOW! Wooosssss!

 

But when the ECU cut in, shut down the engine......haiz....car dead on the expressway.....sian...

 

Hahahah, now just leave my car stock. Too much $$$ into too much trouble into too much heart ache just to get from point A to B.

 

 

[Kelviz23]

Greddy Profec Spec B is a simple but very useful boost controller. Very lasting, used to have it in my GTti. I think the electronic boost controller can advance the timing the boost comes in, correct me if I'm wrong

[Pocus]

  On 1/28/2010 at 3:07 PM, Dfx16 said:

There's some factors that u need takenote of if u want increase boost

 

1. Fuel injectors - Can your stock injectors supply enough fuel for the extra horses

2. Fuel Pump - Can your stock fuel pump handle the extra pressure

3. After Market ECU - Required tunning to prevent car run lean

 

Suggest u get some monitor devices to monitor fuel injectors duty cycle before u increase boost on a stock setup for ex. Greddy Infometer

Ideal duty cycle @ 80% while full boost

Safe play of 20% to prevent boost spike

 

Thanks bro for the heads up, I guess you got the experience from your scratched-built setup.

 

But if I were to keep it below 0.9 I think the stocks components of my ride can still handle it since it's specifically builted for TC unlike the s***ki.

Very dilema at times, esp when warranty issues are concerned.... Not that I so value the warranty but I dun have much confidence on the gearbox esp if it cannot handled a boosted up engine.

Edited January 29, 2010 by Pocus

[Pocus]

  On 1/29/2010 at 3:09 AM, Orixy said:

Pocus: sounds like u r driving a CVR or CPT? :)

 

I have the EVC in my ride and the way it can be customised to boost according to rev (rpm) really made the boost much smoother. Without EVC, can only boost till 0.6bar (stock) and when boost comes, its rather abrupt. I set my target boost at 0.8 - 1.1 bar depending on revs.

 

If you can get a 2nd hand one, why not try the EVC. Or Blitz also not bad.

 

Right on..:)

 

didn't EVC know it's can be programmed to rev specific...but over 1bar wouldn't CEL occur? SO many horror stories and seems our ECU very hard to crack.

[Pocus]

  On 1/29/2010 at 3:57 AM, Ruzhyo said:

I use the Blitz before. From 0.6 bar I up it to 1.3bar.

 

Shiok ah! The power and accleration is great! The noise from the BOV is WOW! Wooosssss!

 

But when the ECU cut in, shut down the engine......haiz....car dead on the expressway.....sian...

 

Hahahah, now just leave my car stock. Too much $$$ into too much trouble into too much heart ache just to get from point A to B.

 

your's CVR? fmic? stock internals? 1.3bar to me like WOW....dun even dare to think about it if on stock ECU and stuff......guess that's why the car go into LIMP mode.

 

[Dwoon]

What is CVR???

 

If tuning is done properly with the supporting mods. I don't see why it can't go to 1.3, or maybe more on stock engine internals.

 

Unless maybe limited by your compression?