My brush with FT

[Topgun]

  On 12/8/2009 at 2:00 AM, Pchmj said:

What for if our country is very rich but most citizens are unhappy? Not that we don't welcome FT but it's just too much, too much till it's affecting our daily life in a negative way, why isn't it a problem 10 years back? We have FT all the while.

 

 

10 years back we didn't have such large proportion of laborers who are from India and China (especially). Most workers you see in factories, construction, even service industries like shopping centre salesgirls, hawker assistants, hairdressers, seamstress, etc were Malaysians. Whom even sometimes when they speak their dialects, although accent sounded different, it's hard to tell they're 'foreign'. They shared similar cultures, values and roots. Same with middle management and exective FT's. Only high level jobs we'd the so-called true FT's aka expats who had expat terms and conditions. In those days, I can really say we don't feel threatened, we don't alienate them nor they feel alienated.

 

But now all these have changed. You walk into any MNC, maybe half excutives and management are S'poreans (and Malaysians PR or non-PR) and the rest are FT's. In IT or Telco, even higher % are foreigners. Shucks even Singtel Call Centre is not even in S'pore! Even more concerting, any hawker centre now, factories,... all are FT's (if I may be so bold as to lump all blue collar workers as FT's too).

 

I worked for a headhunting 4 yrs ago specialising in IT. 90% of our candidates are foreigners, 80% of them are already residing in S'pore holding IT job (and hoping to job hop for better paying positions). My office then was in Suntec (many IT cos), when you're in the lift during lunchtime, going-home time 60% are 'indians'! I always asked my boss, where're all the S'porean IT workers? He also has no answer?

 

So who do we blame? Globalization? Competition? The Gahmen? We ourselves S'poreans???????

 

 

[Axela72]

Why we are giving ppls from other countries free an easy ride, good opportunity?

 

Any recommandation what other country give such treatment (better security, equal opportunity as their local, higher salary with higher exchange rate and better job prospect) in return to us?

 

[Ace]

  On 12/8/2009 at 4:14 AM, Topgun said:

10 years back we didn't have such large proportion of laborers who are from India and China (especially). Most workers you see in factories, construction, even service industries like shopping centre salesgirls, hawker assistants, hairdressers, seamstress, etc were Malaysians. Whom even sometimes when they speak their dialects, although accent sounded different, it's hard to tell they're 'foreign'. They shared similar cultures, values and roots. Same with middle management and exective FT's. Only high level jobs we'd the so-called true FT's aka expats who had expat terms and conditions. In those days, I can really say we don't feel threatened, we don't alienate them nor they feel alienated.

 

But now all these have changed. You walk into any MNC, maybe half excutives and management are S'poreans (and Malaysians PR or non-PR) and the rest are FT's. In IT or Telco, even higher % are foreigners. Shucks even Singtel Call Centre is not even in S'pore! Even more concerting, any hawker centre now, factories,... all are FT's (if I may be so bold as to lump all blue collar workers as FT's too).

 

I worked for a headhunting 4 yrs ago specialising in IT. 90% of our candidates are foreigners, 80% of them are already residing in S'pore holding IT job (and hoping to job hop for better paying positions). My office then was in Suntec (many IT cos), when you're in the lift during lunchtime, going-home time 60% are 'indians'! I always asked my boss, where're all the S'porean IT workers? He also has no answer?

 

So who do we blame? Globalization? Competition? The Gahmen? We ourselves S'poreans???????

 

 

the Singaporean are there.. somewhere out there just that it take some effort to find it.

Too competitive.....

[Rollagt]

  On 12/8/2009 at 4:14 AM, Topgun said:

10 years back we didn't have such large proportion of laborers who are from India and China (especially). Most workers you see in factories, construction, even service industries like shopping centre salesgirls, hawker assistants, hairdressers, seamstress, etc were Malaysians. Whom even sometimes when they speak their dialects, although accent sounded different, it's hard to tell they're 'foreign'. They shared similar cultures, values and roots. Same with middle management and exective FT's. Only high level jobs we'd the so-called true FT's aka expats who had expat terms and conditions. In those days, I can really say we don't feel threatened, we don't alienate them nor they feel alienated.

 

But now all these have changed. You walk into any MNC, maybe half excutives and management are S'poreans (and Malaysians PR or non-PR) and the rest are FT's. In IT or Telco, even higher % are foreigners. Shucks even Singtel Call Centre is not even in S'pore! Even more concerting, any hawker centre now, factories,... all are FT's (if I may be so bold as to lump all blue collar workers as FT's too).

 

I worked for a headhunting 4 yrs ago specialising in IT. 90% of our candidates are foreigners, 80% of them are already residing in S'pore holding IT job (and hoping to job hop for better paying positions). My office then was in Suntec (many IT cos), when you're in the lift during lunchtime, going-home time 60% are 'indians'! I always asked my boss, where're all the S'porean IT workers? He also has no answer?

 

So who do we blame? Globalization? Competition? The Gahmen? We ourselves S'poreans???????

 

After I ORD at 2002, I work part time at a local Uni as an admin assistant while waiting to go Uni.

 

There is a recruitment for IT related position, I am told to photocopy the candidates CVs for the interview and I get to see their profile and asking pay.

1st candidate is a undergraduate whom will be graduating in a month's time. He is a malaysian with Spore PR + no working experience and ask for $2.5K

2nd candidate is from India with 1st class honours + some professional certificates and had 8 years IT work experiences in India + winning a few awards for duno what projects and was featured in the papers. Asking pay is $2K .

 

 

 

 

 

[Bystander50]

  On 12/7/2009 at 4:17 PM, Ahwhye said:

Just to share..... the other day i was about to cross a traffic light to the neighbourhood shopping centre, suddenly felt very strange.....then i realised....

 

of all the people waiting to cross the road

1) a bunch (5 or 6) of loud talking prc,

2) an indian couple with kids... must be FT, their tones/dress/demeanour different from local indians...

3) Philipino couple

4) 3 Myanmar guys

5) lastly me and another dunno local or not.....

 

Strangely they are more worried about FT integration into the society & want locals to open arms/legs to welcome them, shouldn't they give a damn thought for the locals who called this place home and had sweated to protect?

 

I don't feel anything with the presence of those pinyo or burmese in our neighbourhood, at least these people keep to their community and culture.

As for those PRCs, anyone noticed these are the s**t who are stiring up things, trying to influence us with their way of living and culture thinking they are back in PRC.

Just like you as a guest visiting your friend, you never go to their house and influence them with your own way of living.

Sooner or later, our singlish will be called maoish.

 

[Bystander50]

  On 12/7/2009 at 5:29 PM, 2bfree said:

History always.....slowly bt surely repeats itself. Look closely to the history of the world & u will realised dat most natives in their veri own country becomes the minority. Bt seriously, why shld we worry? Our forefathers were oso FTs......we hav the FT blood running in us. Esp Chinese, we will always be the most potential FTs. Look arnd, hw many CHINATOWNS in the world? Sometime we oni hav ourselves to blame for allowin a gap for the FTs to fill. Wat happened? Look deeper. It all started in the late 80s & early 90s. Low birthrate, late marriage, high expectations in a materialistic life, higher studies leading to delay in filling the job markets, shunning blue collar/labour jobs, the big bloom in "salesman" jobs like insurance, property, renovation etc. Alot of factors contribute to the influx of FTs. The country has gaps to fill, locals cant do it & some not willing to do it. I am oso one of them. Wat else can the country do? Bt since it has already reach this stage, which of cos I dun agree wif it, we must step up our game.

 

FTs coming in the mass are ok provided if they are restricted to jobs which locals shun (eg, construction, cleaning, walking streets of GL).

If locals are unable to fill the ranks in other positions, then it contridicts our so called "world class" education system that produces talents.

 

Look at Taiwan, they allow students to go there and study (esp M'sians), but they are not given PRs or work permit automatically to work.

Once they complete their studies, these people will pack their bags and go back home.

 

So why can't the policy makers do the same when promoting our "world class" education institutions?

 

[Bystander50]

  On 12/8/2009 at 12:57 AM, Louisckp said:

you think sg reserves is enough for bricks charity and their salary? come on la, u notice almost every 1.5 months TV will come up some charity show, how come our tax or govt tax not enough? if they cut their pay by 15%, they can easily 'make' 2 island more of lego bricks.

 

get it?

 

After elections, gst sure up again, current amount not enough to help the poor.

 

[Little_prince]

  On 12/8/2009 at 2:02 AM, Kingcopa said:

U play them or they play u?

 

use them as sperm receptacle lor...

[Ngck]

while singapore is moving forward as a whole, common singaporean are still running on the on the same spot.

 

we only move forward so fast with the help of FT. sad to say.

 

but those grand figures and statistics means nothing to the common singaporean.

 

Do we need to move forward at such a speed that we are leaving our countrymen behind?

 

i dunno... must ask the leaders

[Bystander50]

  On 12/8/2009 at 2:12 AM, Apvman said:

True loh. Recently noticed that our common streets, shopping centres and even my FXXKING NEARBY PARKS are filled with Blangas, AhTiongs, Philipnos.....etc.

 

So many of them. Tell what. I know a numver of old folks who used to work in the KOPI Tiams or coffeeshops so that they can substain their livelihood. Now THEY ALL ARE TOLD TO GO OFF... Y?

 

Because the CHEAP, FXXKING AHTIONGS come and KAPO all their jobs. I thought the government is supposed to protect our local pple first, then others. Look at Australia. When Economy is bad, what did the government do? They put strong employment laws to make sure companies hired their local pple first. They cut down on the number of work permits issued and lastly, they make sure that their pple still have a livelihood.

 

Aiyo.. no need talk abt Australia. Look at other countries.. Their locals COME FIRST. Ours? LOCAL COME LAST.

 

U think leh? If the government is doing great, why still need 1 day COOLING PERIOD!? No need cooling period also can win lah if the pple support you.... PERIOD

 

Sg's Macdonalds aunties are fast disappearing too.

 

[Bystander50]

  On 12/8/2009 at 3:05 AM, Axela72 said:

How we know the opposition party is same or different mentalilty?Later win vote liao do the same thing, how?

 

All parties would do the same once they have a firm grip on power.

Compare the ruling party back in the 60s - early 80s and now, in which era do they really feel the ground and has more foresight.

 

This is what happens when one government is in power for too long. Don't be surprised that in the end, sg will be brought down by the ruling party.

It's already repeated a few times in histroy by looking at the Ming and Qing dynasties or the Malacca Sultanate.

 

 

[Ryanyusoff]

  On 12/8/2009 at 5:32 AM, Bystander50 said:

Sg's Macdonalds aunties are fast disappearing too.

 

they change profession to "coupon/sticker" aunties outside shopNsave & Mcdonalds..

[Topgun]

"Even more disconcerting, any hawker centre now, factories,... "

 

error in my earlier post.

 

Just to add. I'm just feeling for my children, whom in a few years time will be joining this rat race competing with not ony their peers, fresh graduates but also with thousands of FT's who are jobless, who also are graduates, but have 2, 3 or more years experience working here when we happen to be in a economic downturn...

 

If the gahmen doesn't do anything to protect our locals for local jobs, imagine this scenario in 2013 another economic downturn like now..

 

Employer A, revenues down, sales pipeline are fake nos, HQ asked to slash jobs...Head of engineering dept cuts 6 junior engineers (1 local 5 FT), 1 snr engineer (local)...

 

Employer B, revenues down, got vacancy for 1 engineer (he migrated!)...same 6 junior engineers apply, local asking for 3.5k, FT asking for 2.5k/mth (local 4k/mth, FT 3k/mth wth Emp A), Snr engineer (local) apply also asking for 6k/mth (from 8k/mth), 50 fresh graduates (10 locals, 10 foreign graduates from local unis, 30 graduates from overseas) also apply, try their luck...hires 1 junior engineer (FT for 2k/mth) and trains him...

 

Empployer C, got vacancies for 2 fresh engineers...5 junior engineer (FT) applies asking for 3k/mth (from 2.5k/mth wth Emp A), 1 snr engineer (local) apply asking for 6k/mth (from 8k/mth), 500 fresh graduates (100 locals, 100 foreign graduates from local unis, 300 graduates from overseas) apply asking for 2k/mth...hires 2 FT experienced engr for 2k/mth (especially locals got to pay more 2.5k/mth CPF, reservist,...)...

 

Still leaves 1 snr engr (local), 2 jnr engr (FT), 1 jnr engr (local) and still 200 fresh graduates from local unis without a job!

 

Maybe nos over-simplified but not exaggerated, probably underestimated I can assure you.

 

Case in point, my niece, this year's NTU graduate in Computer Engineering until November still without a job. Finally took up an admistrative post in a MUSIC SCHOOL working long hours and weekends!

 

She's been (granted she's no New Paper Face of the year, nor an Einstein) searching high and low for IT, Computer sales and marketing, even IR jobs.

 

Is it because of bad timing? Bad choice of uni? Bad choice of course? Born without silver spoon nor connections? Too much competition? Bad luck? No luck?

 

You tell me?

 

 

 

 

[Topgun]

Deleted. Network slow. Repeat post.

Edited December 8, 2009 by Topgun

[Topgun]

I'll be the first one to admit I don' have the answers. And I don't know if there're any answers. I'm just another whiner and complainer here in a car forum.

 

I just know something is very wrong with our society and country. If we don't fix it now, we may already be too late.

 

It's not just PAP or our gahmen, or voting in some opposition in the next GE, I think.

Edited December 8, 2009 by Topgun

[Ace]

  On 12/8/2009 at 5:27 AM, Ngck said:

while singapore is moving forward as a whole, common singaporean are still running on the on the same spot.

 

we only move forward so fast with the help of FT. sad to say.

 

but those grand figures and statistics means nothing to the common singaporean.

 

Do we need to move forward at such a speed that we are leaving our countrymen behind?

 

i dunno... must ask the leaders

 

to me answer is no but to our dear leader yes, our tax base is too low to support their salary

[Ace]

  On 12/8/2009 at 5:51 AM, Topgun said:

"Even more disconcerting, any hawker centre now, factories,... "

 

error in my earlier post.

 

Just to add. I'm just feeling for my children, whom in a few years time will be joining this rat race competing with not ony their peers, fresh graduates but also with thousands of FT's who are jobless, who also are graduates, but have 2, 3 or more years experience working here when we happen to be in a economic downturn...

 

If the gahmen doesn't do anything to protect our locals for local jobs, imagine this scenario in 2013 another economic downturn like now..

 

Employer A, revenues down, sales pipeline are fake nos, HQ asked to slash jobs...Head of engineering dept cuts 6 junior engineers (1 local 5 FT), 1 snr engineer (local)...

 

Employer B, revenues down, got vacancy for 1 engineer (he migrated!)...same 6 junior engineers apply, local asking for 3.5k, FT asking for 2.5k/mth (local 4k/mth, FT 3k/mth wth Emp A), Snr engineer (local) apply also asking for 6k/mth (from 8k/mth), 50 fresh graduates (10 locals, 10 foreign graduates from local unis, 30 graduates from overseas) also apply, try their luck...hires 1 junior engineer (FT for 2k/mth) and trains him...

 

Empployer C, got vacancies for 2 fresh engineers...5 junior engineer (FT) applies asking for 3k/mth (from 2.5k/mth wth Emp A), 1 snr engineer (local) apply asking for 6k/mth (from 8k/mth), 500 fresh graduates (100 locals, 100 foreign graduates from local unis, 300 graduates from overseas) apply asking for 2k/mth...hires 2 FT experienced engr for 2k/mth (especially locals got to pay more 2.5k/mth CPF, reservist,...)...

 

Still leaves 1 snr engr (local), 2 jnr engr (FT), 1 jnr engr (local) and still 200 fresh graduates from local unis without a job!

 

Maybe nos over-simplified but not exaggerated, probably underestimated I can assure you.

 

Case in point, my niece, this year's NTU graduate in Computer Engineering until November still without a job. Finally took up an admistrative post in a MUSIC SCHOOL working long hours and weekends!

 

She's been (granted she's no New Paper Face of the year, nor an Einstein) searching high and low for IT, Computer sales and marketing, even IR jobs.

 

Is it because of bad timing? Bad choice of uni? Bad choice of course? Born without silver spoon nor connections? Too much competition? Bad luck? No luck?

 

You tell me?

 

IT line is one of the most overflood industry with FT. I am in this line. Your niece got to specialise and carve a niche for herself to survive. When I start in this industry more than 10 years ago. There is already FT around but pct wise is half-half. Now is like maybe 2 LT and 8 FT so it is more competitvely nowsaday. I have heard and seen FT come to Singapore for job search and serverly undercut the market rate in order to land a job.

 

But then that is the harsh reality of life. It is like you are again wave and wave of competition in the crest for job and more so with budget airline

[Bigg]

all new FT male,18years and above should enter 2 years NS first. hows that?