As I get older, I learnt that LKY had to do what is needed

[Noobcar]

  On 11/18/2009 at 7:09 AM, Karoon said:

looking at our neighbours, we should consider ourselves lucky

we do not have any natural resources

 

i see it this way, LKY and his team lead but the people are the ones that eventually made singapore what it is today

 

our history did not start in the 1960s.

 

back in the 1400s empires fought over this land. johor by chance had it when the brits came and gave it away.

everyone wanted us for our strategic location. the brits turned it from a regional port to an international one.

 

its laughable to pin all the 'success' on one man.

 

I am quite anti PAP, if u guys have seen many of my post , but we have to agree with no natural resourses and little $$ after the brits pull out, old man had done a very impressive job.

 

In the first 25 yrs or so of Sg independent PAP have done a wonderful job to build up Sg as it is now, I believe in his heavy handed method is necessary during a chaotic time when we just got our independent but I think the method is out dated now.

 

Now PAP is all about $$ making instead of helping the citizen, which I am quite against many of their so call policy...

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:24 AM, Piyopico said:

No one is arguing against giving credit when it is due.

 

People are just upset that accountability does not go along with their clamour for credit and recognition. I can give you a long list of things that he did that has proven to be wrong and WE are still paying the price..............

i understand completely

i am trying to accept things i cannot change

hopefully there is a better tomorrow

thanks

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:26 AM, Noobcar said:

I am quite anti PAP, if u guys have seen many of my post , but we have to agree with no natural resourses and little $$ after the brits pull out, old man had done a very impressive job.

 

In the first 25 yrs or so of Sg independent PAP have done a wonderful job to build up Sg as it is now, I believe in his heavy handed method is necessary during a chaotic time when we just got our independent but I think the method is out dated now.

 

Now PAP is all about $$ making instead of helping the citizen, which I am quite against many of their so call policy...

i share your sentiments

but could it because society has a part to play creating the type of politicians we want

afterall we as a society, majority have given them the mandate

hence we have to accept until the countries policy change or parties change

the furture is a great unknown

 

the question is really, do we compromise with what we have or do we want to wake up to be another iceland - bankrupt

[Joseph22]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:11 AM, Iisterry said:

I seriously advise revisiting your history before making such sweeping statements that LKY is responsible for Singapore's success today. It is a grave insult to the rest of the PAP old guards.

 

Perhaps this blog can give some refresher. It is highly pro-government in case you're thinking otherwise.

 

http://singaporegovt.blogspot.com/2006/01/...-of-pap-no.html

 

As for China.

 

 

Yes no doubt that the old Guard need to be reconised. But the truth is still that, if LKY did not place the vision for Singapore and work towards it, and choosing the right ppl (old Guards) to be in his team. will he be where he is?

No doubt that the Old Guard needed to be applaud but the fact remain that the success of the nation is base on the decision of 1 man.

Let face it, if he did not first accept and then decide to implement the proposal of the old guard, do you think the policy will go through?

 

[Noobcar]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:46 AM, City100a said:

i share your sentiments

but could it because society has a part to play creating the type of politicians we want

afterall we as a society, majority have given them the mandate

hence we have to accept until the countries policy change or parties change

the furture is a great unknown

 

the question is really, do we compromise with what we have or do we want to wake up to be another iceland - bankrupt

 

That is why PAP still stay in power, until now I still respect LKY but what if one day he past away? What will PAP become, will there be a strong and good oppsition to challenge them? Will PAP be as strong as old man when old man is still around?

 

It is a gamble we as Singaporean will be making a huge step towards unknow. We won't know until we put our leg forward. But for now I don't think there are any good oppsition around, although I will still vote against PAP just to let them know that the citizen are the one that have the final said not PAP.

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:57 AM, Noobcar said:

That is why PAP still stay in power, until now I still respect LKY but what if one day he past away? What will PAP become, will there be a strong and good oppsition to challenge them? Will PAP be as strong as old man when old man is still around?

 

It is a gamble we as Singaporean will be making a huge step towards unknow. We won't know until we put our leg forward. But for now I don't think there are any good oppsition around, although I will still vote against PAP just to let them know that the citizen are the one that have the final said not PAP.

i admire your convictions

thank you

you are an inspiration

[Tonyhawk]

hmm...... my worry is that we may have created a generation of money/power grubbing leaders, where without the $$, they wouldnt be ministers. this is a direct consequence of pragmatism, chasing economic success measured in $$, prosperity measured in GDP growth. and so we have a generation where $$ talks. brilliant as our scholars may be, its all about the $$.

 

look around you, and even within yourself: who would work for a worthy cause, for half the salary? i wouldnt, would you?

Edited November 18, 2009 by Tonyhawk

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:50 AM, Joseph22 said:

Yes no doubt that the old Guard need to be reconised. But the truth is still that, if LKY did not place the vision for Singapore and work towards it, and choosing the right ppl (old Guards) to be in his team. will he be where he is?

No doubt that the Old Guard needed to be applaud but the fact remain that the success of the nation is base on the decision of 1 man.

Let face it, if he did not first accept and then decide to implement the proposal of the old guard, do you think the policy will go through?

well said, nobody could have said it better than you

concise precise

[Gearoil]

I think TS is a damn idiot...idolising LKY as a GOD!

 

He probably believed that his entire team was elected with at least 66.6% during the last erection!

 

Where the actual percentage was only 40+% thereabout if they didn't play their dirty game of walk-overs and GRCs.

 

How many of you are like this here?

[Iisterry]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:50 AM, Joseph22 said:

Yes no doubt that the old Guard need to be reconised. But the truth is still that, if LKY did not place the vision for Singapore and work towards it, and choosing the right ppl (old Guards) to be in his team. will he be where he is?

No doubt that the Old Guard needed to be applaud but the fact remain that the success of the nation is base on the decision of 1 man.

Let face it, if he did not first accept and then decide to implement the proposal of the old guard, do you think the policy will go through?

 

Actually...

 

  Quote

Dr Toh Chin Chye: The Man Who Made PAP

 

[B777jubilee]

  On 11/18/2009 at 8:57 AM, Noobcar said:

That is why PAP still stay in power, until now I still respect LKY but what if one day he past away? What will PAP become, will there be a strong and good oppsition to challenge them? Will PAP be as strong as old man when old man is still around?

 

It is a gamble we as Singaporean will be making a huge step towards unknow. We won't know until we put our leg forward. But for now I don't think there are any good oppsition around, although I will still vote against PAP just to let them know that the citizen are the one that have the final said not PAP.

 

 

but then, i kinda worried with the newer generation. Remember PM son Li HongYi make some complain directly to the Minister for Defence and completely bypass the chain of command? none of us in army dare to do this... we know we sure kena f

 

But for me, I have respect for old man, it may be easy to brush him off, but to make tough decisions in tough times, where Singapore is facing high unemployment, uncertain future, communism threat, no $$ in the govrnment coffers, its takes a superhuman effort to take these tasks on and bring the country to what it is today.

Edited November 18, 2009 by B777jubilee

[Noobcar]

  On 11/18/2009 at 9:39 AM, B777jubilee said:

but then, i kinda worried with the newer generation. Remember PM son Li HongYi make some complain directly to the Minister for Defence and completely bypass the chain of command? If its any other ones who did it, the person will kena left right centre, but for this case, it seems that nothing happened.

 

by then old man not around liao, u think PAP will be that strong. I believe there will be a lot of internal struggle once old man not around to pull the party together. The new generation won't be under the Lee, I believe. Hopefully there are some good leader that can stand up and challenge the sit of power. (This is only my personal point of view only.)

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 9:24 AM, Iisterry said:

Actually...

 

Dr Toh Chin Chye: The Man Who Made PAP

 

[Ngck]

  On 11/18/2009 at 9:39 AM, B777jubilee said:

but then, i kinda worried with the newer generation. Remember PM son Li HongYi make some complain directly to the Minister for Defence and completely bypass the chain of command? none of us in army dare to do this... we know we sure kena f

 

But for me, I have respect for old man, it may be easy to brush him off, but to make tough decisions in tough times, where Singapore is facing high unemployment, uncertain future, communism threat, no $$ in the govrnment coffers, its takes a superhuman effort to take these tasks on and bring the country to what it is today.

 

 

if he complain at home to his father, is he bypassing chain of command again?

 

haha

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 9:24 AM, Gearoil said:

I think TS is a damn idiot...idolising LKY as a GOD!

 

He probably believed that his entire team was elected with at least 66.6% during the last erection!

 

Where the actual percentage was only 40+% thereabout if they didn't play their dirty game of walk-overs and GRCs.

 

How many of you are like this here?

is it too difficult for you accept that others may have different opinions

i do respect your opinion and reasoning

 

but the fact of the matter is that it could have been a different singapore without him, perhaps better or even worse such as Aceh

the founding fathers of singapore are what we are appreciating here when we look at the surrounding countries

 

look at the middle east, look at malaysia, look at indonesia

 

tell me, why is it that i can celebrate depavali. CNY, christmas and ramadam with my neighbours and friends here is singapore

 

 

there are lots of views and dissatifaction

but what are all these dissatisfaction, majority are just self interest

 

if we are all like our founding fathers, we all would be fighting for eradicating poverty in singapore and not about which constituency is going get upgrading

 

that is the big difference

 

dont let our founding fathers effort and dreams go to waste

 

it is not just LKY but including his team that i was referring to

 

thanks for being tolerant

[City100a]

  On 11/18/2009 at 10:04 AM, Ngck said:

if he complain at home to his father, is he bypassing chain of command again?

 

haha

good one

[Mr_b20]

erection coming soon issit ? u some rc member or grassroot member ?

lol wtf

[Xspace]

Yes, he did alot... But not w/o sacrificing alot pple who helped him too...