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Vtec vs iVtec


Quantum
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read from other forum talking about Vtec and iVtec,

iVtec FC is not better than VVTi, and power not able to beat pure Vtec [:(]

wonder why honda invented iVtec to instead of Vtec[confused]

tks

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Many years back , Honda started Vtec which was answered by Toyota VVTi-L, very high revving, only good for track. Since Honda pioneer this technology, Honda's Vtec is still more powerful than Toyota's VVTi-L.

 

Toyota then go into VVT-i which is great for economy and mid-range torque, more user friendly because torque is what we need in every day driving. Honda also realised the flaws of Vtec and hence run the same concept of VVT-i and name it as iVtec. Since Toyota is the pioneer this time, VVT-i is superior to iVtec.

 

Till date, many other Jap engine makers all using Variable Valve timing on their cams one way or another and they name it whatever they wish.

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Nowadays, car manufacturers are producing cars that are environmentally friendly and waste less fuel, also have to comply with Euro emission standard to reduce CO2 emissions.

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  On 9/19/2009 at 9:57 AM, Chickensoup said:

Many years back , Honda started Vtec which was answered by Toyota VVTi-L, very high revving, only good for track. Since Honda pioneer this technology, Honda's Vtec is still more powerful than Toyota's VVTi-L.

 

Toyota then go into VVT-i which is great for economy and mid-range torque, more user friendly because torque is what we need in every day driving. Honda also realised the flaws of Vtec and hence run the same concept of VVT-i and name it as iVtec. Since Toyota is the pioneer this time, VVT-i is superior to iVtec.

 

Till date, many other Jap engine makers all using Variable Valve timing on their cams one way or another and they name it whatever they wish.

iVtec is better mid-range torque than Vtec [scholar]

 

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  On 9/19/2009 at 10:10 AM, Quantum said:

iVtec is better mid-range torque than Vtec [scholar]

You will feel it when you drive the car. Power and torque delivery is completely different in iVtec and VVT-i. Specs could be very close.

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  On 9/19/2009 at 10:10 AM, Quantum said:

iVtec is better mid-range torque than Vtec [scholar]

 

Not really accurate for the current K series engines.

 

Let's use the current K series to explain. All K series engines are i-VTEC, regardless if they're Type R or normal models.

 

The i-VTEC basically means the capability to continuously vary the cam advance angle, thereby ensuring good torque through the entire rpm. If you've seen the tuning for K series engines, you'll see the tuner typically tunes for each cam angle, then composites them to find the best torque and whp curve. So at low rpm, he may choose to advance cam by 20 deg, then switch to 10 deg when he crosses 4000rpm, and so on.

 

The traditional VTEC in the K series engines is only available for the JDM Type R's and the USDM Type S models (K20A, K20A2). They feature a wild cam with a very aggressive profile that is only activated beyond a certain rpm. This is because the wild cam profile is too aggressive and will actually make less power at lower rpm, and may cause idling issues. Hence they are only activated beyond the point when they produce more whp than the normal cams. This cross-over point is adjustable with KPro.

 

However, the non Type R engines like the K20A3 features some enhancements for fuel economy. These include a variable intake manifold, a recessed piston head design to promote swirl in the air/fuel mixture during low rpms, and switching from 16 to 12 valves below 2200rpm.

 

The beauty of the K20A is that it's FC is about the same as the normal cars if you drive below the VTEC cross over point.

Edited by Vblaster_w211
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anyone know if i-vtec can be tuned like the old vtec? i remember i sold my old EG9 to a friend who like to play with cars then he add this console when he can make all the settings for his vtec to come alive..

 

if i-vtec can be tuned like vtec then maybe i will hope to buy a honda for daily use. my previous crv's i-vtec will kick in at about 2700rpm there abouts..

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i see. Kpro is what they called the vtec controller right?

 

actually i am thinking of getting a euro r if it can be tuned like the old EG and letting my wife drive my current suv.

Edited by Rainmaker
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For Euro R, the choice is obvious. KPro. Forget all others unless you're going really high end like FCon VPro or MOTEC.

 

Hondata KPro is not just a VTEC controller. It is a Honda ECU reprogrammed by Hondata so that almost all parameters are tunable.

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  On 9/19/2009 at 11:12 AM, Vblaster_w211 said:

Not really accurate for the current K series engines.

 

Let's use the current K series to explain. All K series engines are i-VTEC, regardless if they're Type R or normal models.

 

The i-VTEC basically means the capability to continuously vary the cam advance angle, thereby ensuring good torque through the entire rpm. If you've seen the tuning for K series engines, you'll see the tuner typically tunes for each cam angle, then composites them to find the best torque and whp curve. So at low rpm, he may choose to advance cam by 20 deg, then switch to 10 deg when he crosses 4000rpm, and so on.

 

The traditional VTEC in the K series engines is only available for the JDM Type R's and the USDM Type S models (K20A, K20A2). They feature a wild cam with a very aggressive profile that is only activated beyond a certain rpm. This is because the wild cam profile is too aggressive and will actually make less power at lower rpm, and may cause idling issues. Hence they are only activated beyond the point when they produce more whp than the normal cams. This cross-over point is adjustable with KPro.

 

However, the non Type R engines like the K20A3 features some enhancements for fuel economy. These include a variable intake manifold, a recessed piston head design to promote swirl in the air/fuel mixture during low rpms, and switching from 16 to 12 valves below 2200rpm.

 

The beauty of the K20A is that it's FC is about the same as the normal cars if you drive below the VTEC cross over point.

do you know what is iVtec kick in rpm?

 

 

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Read carefully about what I wrote about i-VTEC. It does not "kick in". It is about engine design feature with variable cam phasing.

 

The wild cam VTEC on a K20A normally kicks in around 5800rpm.

Edited by Vblaster_w211
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  On 9/19/2009 at 9:57 AM, Chickensoup said:

Many years back , Honda started Vtec which was answered by Toyota VVTi-L, very high revving, only good for track. Since Honda pioneer this technology, Honda's Vtec is still more powerful than Toyota's VVTi-L.

 

Toyota then go into VVT-i which is great for economy and mid-range torque, more user friendly because torque is what we need in every day driving. Honda also realised the flaws of Vtec and hence run the same concept of VVT-i and name it as iVtec. Since Toyota is the pioneer this time, VVT-i is superior to iVtec.

 

Till date, many other Jap engine makers all using Variable Valve timing on their cams one way or another and they name it whatever they wish.

 

Some of your facts are wrong.

 

Toyota's technology is VVTL-i, not VVTi-L. Also, VVT-i came before VVTL-i, by at least 7-8 years.

 

 

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It's simple. For i-Vtec the torque is distributed evenly throughout all range of the rpm while Vtec's torque is all "concentrated" at the max rpm. That's why ppl say they feel a shove in the back when they rev hard until "Vtec open".

 

For i-Vtec, you dun have to hit high rpm to get the torque to accelerate. A tap on the throttle, the power will deliver, it's much easier and more relaxing to drive. And it's design for economy and to meet CO2 emission standards. The emission standard more dan a decade ago(Vtec technology) is much lower dan today's standard so manufacturers have to redesign their engine to keep up. I'm not surprised they change their marketing strategy to target families and not racer boys.

Edited by Watwheels
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