Can sue easily, But can win case or not?

[Nus24]

Man sues car dealer over sale of year-old vehicle

 

Christopher Tan

Fri, Aug 17, 2007

The Straits Times

 

 

 

THE buyer of a Volkswagen Beetle is suing the sellers for selling him a car that was over a year old even before it was put on the road here.

 

Late last December, Muhamed Ali Abdul Rashid, 36, bought the $72,000 car from Car & Cars, then the dealer for VW.

 

When the car was ready for delivery on Feb 15 this year, he realised from the registration card that the vehicle was made in 2005.

 

He refused the car, which has since been with Volkswagen Group Singapore (VGS), a regional unit of the carmaker that took over the import and sales of VW here from Car & Cars earlier this year.

 

In what lawyers say is the first case of its kind, Mr Muhamed Ali, the regional manager of a manufacturing company, is claiming, among other things, a refund and financing charges he has incurred on his car loan so far.

 

He told The Straits Times: "They did offer me a few thousand dollars as compensation, but it's not about the money. I asked for a new car and I expect a new car."

 

In the case, slated for hearing on Sept 4, he will be represented by A. Mohamed Hashim, and Car & Cars by Chong, Chia & Lim. VGS, to be represented by KhattarWong, has been named as a third party.

 

The Straits Times understands that if the court rules in Mr Muhamed Ali's favour, Car & Cars will seek recourse and claim whatever it has to pay its former customer from VGS.

 

When contacted, VGS managing director Olaf Duebel said the case was "something between the customer and Car & Cars".

 

He said the car was manufactured in Mexico in late 2005, and would have taken three or four months to arrive here by ship.

 

Mr Duebel said: "It was scheduled to be delivered in mid-2006. You'll have to ask Car & Cars why it took so long to deliver it, and why it asked specifically for this car."

 

Mr Peter Kwee, the owner of Car & Cars, said the black Beetle was among a batch of cars ordered in April last year. By July, the car had arrived, and could have been sold if there was a buyer.

 

But it was not sold until December: Mr Muhamed Ali signed the sales agreement on Dec 29.

 

As to why Car & Cars picked this car from its stock, Mr Kwee said it was drawn from what Car & Cars had in hand, and that the dealer did not know at the time that it was a 2005 car.

 

He added that if Car & Cars had known, the customer would have been told - especially since the car was to be delivered only this year.

 

Industry players say that discounts of $1,000 or more are usually offered for older cars.

 

But what is "older"?

 

Motor Traders Association president Michael Wong said there is no standard definition, but generally, companies would offer a discount if the car arrived here more than seven to eight months before.

 

"It is better to be upfront with customers, because they will find out eventually," he said.

 

Mr Marc Singleton, chief operating officer of Audi agent Premium Automobiles, said: "You'd be in trouble if you tried to hide it."

 

BMW agent Performance Motors' spokesman Belinda Bay said it was company policy to declare the year of manufacture, and that its sales agreement has a field that states this in black and white.

 

At Honda agent Kah Motor, product manager Vincent Ng said: "We have to make the year of manufacture clear to customers. As a rule, we offer a discount if the car was made more than a year ago."

 

But one dealer for a continental brand who did not wish to be named admitted that customers are told of the manufacture date "only if they ask". "But even if we do not tell, we will sell the older cars at a more attractive price," he said.

 

Cars take about three weeks to be shipped here from Japan, four weeks from Europe and eight to 10 weeks from the United States

[Nus24]

$72k for a brand new beetle...thats cheap.

I remember few yrs ago when Zoe Tay bought one..it was like $150k brand new.

 

Got a few K compensation after he Hoo-Haa to dealer.

Assuming got $4k compensation....then $68K is a jolly good price isn't it?

 

In the eye of the lay the car belongs to who? He may reject it, but the loan and LTA records shows the car is rightfully his even if he reject also no use right? After all he already 'paid' for the car.

If he refuse to pay the loan monthly...can the car be repo and sold to recover cost by the bank? Assuming he refuse to pay the loan since Feb07....the bank got rights to repo right?

But then if he pays the bank loan then it means he already accept the car? Then no case to fight?

 

Anyone?

[Tarzan666]

THis name peter kwee sounds familiar..is he the biznessman who owns geely dealership in spore now?

[Apollo]

u free i can get porker to exprain the whole nite how merchantile law works..

 

pls leave ur name and lumber behind and we will get back to u shortly.

[Galantspeedz]

just curious.

 

if it was ready stock, why need 2 months to deliver?

 

COE got so hard to get meh?

[Apollo]

need to clear LTA paperwork lah.

 

probably their 1st time with the beetle. not surprized.

[Pisces69]

The one & only Mr.Car.

 

He has been dealing in cars for many years now.

[Pisces69]

It mentions this is the Made in Mexico Beetle & not the German 2nd generation Beetle.

 

If I am not mistaken, this guy bought the rear engined "original" VW Bug.

[Typhoonz]

YOM 2005 but still considered new right?

[Chickenfarm]

$72k for a brand new beetle...thats cheap.

I remember few yrs ago when Zoe Tay bought one..it was like $150k brand new.

 

Got a few K compensation after he Hoo-Haa to dealer.

Assuming got $4k compensation....then $68K is a jolly good price isn't it?

 

In the eye of the lay the car belongs to who? He may reject it, but the loan and LTA records shows the car is rightfully his even if he reject also no use right? After all he already 'paid' for the car.

If he refuse to pay the loan monthly...can the car be repo and sold to recover cost by the bank? Assuming he refuse to pay the loan since Feb07....the bank got rights to repo right?

But then if he pays the bank loan then it means he already accept the car? Then no case to fight?

 

Anyone?

 

The one bought by Zoey Tay and Brian Wong then was a 2L new beetle sis...not this 1.6L version. Under commercial law, he can refuse delivery if the car turns out to be not what he'd bargained for. Whether he does have a case or not will largely depend on how he make out his story in his claims.

Edited September 3, 2007 by Chickenfarm

[Chickenfarm]

THis name peter kwee sounds familiar..is he the biznessman who owns geely dealership in spore now?

 

U're right...b4 switching abruptly to dealing in Geely, he was the man running "Cars and Cars"...the local dealer for VW fleets. Those who visited their Leng Kee showroom in dec 2006 will know that they were trying to clear ready stocks and doesn't offer test drives. Then suddenly, the big annoucement came and many new buyers were left in the lurch

Edited September 3, 2007 by Chickenfarm

[Weichien]

cannot sue 1.

sure lose.

[Sci10213]

This is a case of its first. Depend on how the lawyers argue, there is still a possibility that can win.

 

So if win, then it becomes a precedent case law.

[Tohhk]

Does anyone know the outcome of the case? I want to know because I'm facing the new problem: Asked to collect a new car manufactured 1.5 year ago.

 

I came to know about the date only after receiving the LTA registration details, but before accepting the car.

 

Appreciate advice on what to do next. Ask for discount or extended warrenty? Damn angry because the AD is one of the Singapore leading dealers.