ALL consolidated SMRT/NEL/KT.. simisai BREAKDOWNS here!

[Volvobrick]

It is a BIG COVER UP operation using all those canvas!

 

Whoever selected and accepted the defective products must cum clean.....

[Wishcumstrue]

 

There are many issues involved now - transparency, safety, security (arising from the drones)... I think foremost on people's minds is transparency. What are they trying to hide and who are they trying to protect? We should stay focused on this.

 

I agree with you on the covers. See my previous post:

 

 

I agree there are several ways to see this report.

 

However, I still fail to see how a foreign media should past this off as "secret" or lack of transparency simply based on how the train was wrapped up and  being return to the manufacturer ?

 

Also what benefit LTA or SMRT will get by covering up a problem which isn't its making ? 

 

To prevent any further erosion of public confidence with our railway ?

 

This question is best asked by Singaporeans, not determined by foreign news media with their own political agenda...

 

So lets' wait and see before passing quick judgement before all the facts are established.

 

 

[Darryn]

I agree there are several ways to see this report.

 

However, I still fail to see how a foreign media should past this off as "secret" or lack of transparency simply based on how the train was wrapped up and being return to the manufacturer ?

 

Also what benefit LTA or SMRT will get by covering up a problem which isn't its making ?

 

To prevent any further erosion of public confidence with our railway ?

 

This question is best asked by Singaporeans, not determined by foreign news media with their own political agenda...

 

So lets' wait and see before passing quick judgement before all the facts are established.

 

 

Despite multiple breakdowns and investigations and the problems starting FOUR YEARS ago has there been any announcements of this locally at all?

When new trains come is announced big big.

 

I'd say there is definitive proof that there has been a "cover up"

[Maxus-MIFA9]

AFAIK, none of the incoming new MRT trains were ever wrap up like the returning ones, regardless of the vendors.

 

That also includes the latest driver-less models from France to the 1st generation trains  in the 1980s - majority were moved during night time when traffic is light.

 

In fact, this is the 1st known case of having trains being return and to suspect this is all "secret" operation because the carriages are wrap and moved during night time is to me nothing more than juicing up an "investigative" journalism.

 

And by your reference that the contract involving "state own enterprise" is indeed, in line with what I had suspected about this HK-origin news - This is all about politics.

 

 

 

Politics or not, without it we are still in the dark about this and it happen since 2011.

 

Two elections had gone by and we are kept in the dark. 

 

Same goes with the AHGTC saga, without it we didn't know that a $2/- capital company can bid for a multi million computer maintenance contract, didn't know that ceiling not clean could have a parliament hearing on it.  

 

Wonder which is more serious : a few thousand dollars ceiling cleaning vs hundreds over million dollars faulty trains..  

[Playtime]

I agree there are several ways to see this report.

 

However, I still fail to see how a foreign media should past this off as "secret" or lack of transparency simply based on how the train was wrapped up and being return to the manufacturer ?

 

Also what benefit LTA or SMRT will get by covering up a problem which isn't its making ?

 

To prevent any further erosion of public confidence with our railway ?

 

This question is best asked by Singaporeans, not determined by foreign news media with their own political agenda...

 

So lets' wait and see before passing quick judgement before all the facts are established.

 

 

With that line of argument.

 

Our media reported:

Edward Snowden

Najib plenty stuff

Anwar and mahathir.

Indo palm fires and the companies

Corruption scandals all over.

Prc island building activities

 

You get the picture.

 

To say there's no cover up is really a stretch.

To shoot the messenger is being an ostrich.

[RadX]

interesting:

 

 

 

By now you would have heard about expose by a HK New Agency that did groundwork in China and Singapore including tracking of defective trains from Bishan Depot to Jurong Port after midnight.

Here are details. 

1. Infrastructure and rolling stock belongs to LTA and not SMRT or the other subway operators. LTA placed the contract in 2009 for 22 trains and a further 13 trains in 2011 to the second highest bidder. This consortium was led by Kawasaki who have supplying trains cars to MRT since 1986. The 2009 and 2011 contracts was the first to include a Chinese partner who will do the main build. 

2. The first trains from the Chinese builder went on line in May 2011 with the last of the first 22 to be operational by 2012. The remaining 13 would come online in 2013. However issues kept popping up from day 1 when the first trains arrived in May 2011. Within 3 months significant defects including cracked undercarriage, body and the actual integrity of the whole construction was being questioned. This is when the first cover-up began in earnest because the PM apologised to the nation in May 2011 during GE2011 and more bad news was not going to help matters. 

3. The shattered windows and exploding batteries were all minor and a smoke screen. SMRT and Temasek refused to be held responsible for the defects and it fell on LTA and Ministry of Transport to resolve it. 

4. LTA then came up with their disingenuous plan B to cover up the mess which involved every single one of the trains and no just the 26. They would order more new trains much earlier the usual and do a switch over when the new replacement trains came on line. To give a semblance of normalcy they again awarded contracts to the same consortium but in this case, the main build be done by Kawasaki and the Chinese company do only assembly work. 

5. Plan B also involved Kawasaki to do monthly checks on these trains and do onsite rectification ( read as temporary repairs until return of the entire train). This charade began in late 2011 and continued till they were returned which is in 2016. Imagine your Toyota car being inspected every month by Borneo motors to ensure safety. Unheard of? But necessary as they were not sure if it will fall apart or be unsafe. Yes, you heard it right, the manufacturer checking every one of the 35 trains ever month in Singapore for the last few years. 

6. So in 2012, LTA accelerated new replacement train procurement programme to do the coverup. 

7. Here is the interesting and rather explosive bid - the trains that are returned are to completely stripped and disassembled, parts cannibalised for new body work and bogie (undercarriage) to be assembled. The Chinese company will no longer be in manufacturing but will only assemble parts provided by Kawasaki. Kawasaki will build the body and the bogie plus all the main components. So the entire Contract 151A build has been screwed up - not fit for purpose. 

8. Here is the second explosive bit - SMRT Head of Trains Lee Ling Wee without coordinating with LTA yesterday revealed that these returned trains will fixed and sent back to Singapore in 2023. 7 years later!!! LTA's news release yesterday did not reveal this. Here is the short answer. Remember the accelerated programme in 2012 that was part of the cover-up and with further orders since then to meet demand. Well apparently we no longer need these trains as they will be surplus to stock and will be rusting in the yard if they are returned immediately. 

9. The person who told me this even said that Mindef procurement who have their own share of mishaps in purchasing equipment such as ships, tanks, planes etc did not screw as badly as this and did organise coverup of this nature that ran for 5 years in such an organised manner. 

10. More striking is the involvement of Japanese company who together with LTA kept this entirely secret for 5 years from Singaporeans. The leak interestingly came from the executives from the Chinese company who apparently never had trains returned from another country and treated the event with great novelty. 

Here are the main concerns. 

1. Can we trust this Government when they go to this extent to do a cover up.

2. Did Kawasaki pad the numbers in subsequent contacts to cover the cost of rebuilding the trains in contract 151A. Most commercial entities will logically do that when they know they are called to be involved in the coverup. 

3. Why were subsequent contracts awarded to the same consortium and thereby directly rewarding them for sub-standard products. I buy a car which turns out to be a lemon and I then buy a second car from the same dealer who gives me a 10% discount. So I have 2 cars when I only need one and I paid for both of them minus the 10% discount for the second. Does this make sense? 

4. When you have structural cracks both in the body and the bogie, how can LTA claim that safety is not issue. It is so bad and the integrity of the train build is such an issue that they will be completely stripped and disassembled and both the body and bogie will be manufactured from scratch. Does LTA statement makes sense. 

4. Should it not be time that the Auditor General steps in to carry out an thorough investigation on this entire debacle. Should this not be the subject of an independent board of inquiry.

 

[Yewheng]

Politics or not, without it we are still in the dark about this and it happen since 2011.

 

Two elections had gone by and we are kept in the dark.

 

Same goes with the AHGTC saga, without it we didn't know that a $2/- capital company can bid for a multi million computer maintenance contract, didn't know that ceiling not clean could have a parliament hearing on it.

 

Wonder which is more serious : a few thousand dollars ceiling cleaning vs hundreds over million dollars faulty trains..

For the town council, this remind me of how pap keep bring out on wp town council issue. When there is a slightest thing that they could catch, they will make it a big news. Minewhile their own backyard and also government agencies there is some problem, they try to cover up as much as possible. So it all boils down to politics isn't it?

 

If lta were private company and with this kind of big recalls, I am 100% sure those who accept the tender and also many who are in charge of the project will be at the chopping board. It causes company to lose big money and private companies are not charity organization. Too bad lta is a government organization so any big mistake, these people still Bo dai ji continue working. This is the difference between how private and government organization runs. In a way, private organization actually runs more effectively then government as they need to see profit. Whereas government organization? Make a loss due to bad deal nevermind, it's tax payers money, can just ask government to fund in more money for help and also cover-up.

 

So kanna exposed is a good thing as end of the day it goes to do with tax payers money and we must ensure government organization runs like private organization like when there is so big bad investment or errors or loss involved, be prepared for chopping board. The better ones will take over.

Edited July 6, 2016 by Yewheng

[Kangadrool]

"Secret" 'cos the trains are all wrapped up like bolster-shaped bak chang.

 

This type of operation normally at night one, needs advance booking for police escort. So, this makes it even more "secret".

 

I just can't imagine the trucking bills especially the cometto. It's like at least $50,000 per block of X hours per trip; thereafter $5,000 per hour or part of for demurrage.... something liddat....

 

The cranes mobilised for lifting is another big ticket item.

 

Total costs will be higher than ocean freight for sure.

 

So far, it seems the defects are found only the 1st batch (model code C151A) which was in use since 2011.

 

A 2nd batch (C151B) will start operating this year. This batch isn't listed in the HK's media report.

 

C151B delivered last year - Also at night when traffic is light.

 

Don't understand why the HK media consider this as "secret" .

 

C151B will have new white livery.

 

[Vratenza]

Lol.. They are not Amazon.CN leh.... Don't have the same returns policy as Amazon.com lah.. 

 

On a more serious note. It's a cover up mah, and the returned trains are supposed to be cannabalised for  brand new trains to be built. Apparently the defects are extensive enough that whole train cannot be repaired. No safety issue?! 

 

Why cannot they send the replacement trains then we send them back the defective trains?

 

Sorry but trust usually doesn't rank very high on their agenda

 

[Duckduck]

ayah sgh hepc case also nobody got indicted. dom sarron lee die even better no court case.

 

basically we just behave n be good doggies ok? eat your food, por your master lumpa n all is well

[Darryn]

With that line of argument.

 

Our media reported:

Edward Snowden

Najib plenty stuff

Anwar and mahathir.

Indo palm fires and the companies

Corruption scandals all over.

Prc island building activities

 

You get the picture.

 

To say there's no cover up is really a stretch.

To shoot the messenger is being an ostrich.

The strategy is to try and make this about foreign interference in domestic matters and the drone in restricted area

[Weez911]

The strategy is to try and make this about foreign interference in domestic matters and the drone in restricted area

Darn, I just praised u. Indeed, confusion is often the best alternative medicine of confession.  

Edited July 7, 2016 by Weez911

[Watwheels]

"Secret" 'cos the trains are all wrapped up like bolster-shaped bak chang.

 

This type of operation normally at night one, needs advance booking for police escort. So, this makes it even more "secret".

 

I just can't imagine the trucking bills especially the cometto. It's like at least $50,000 per block of X hours per trip; thereafter $5,000 per hour or part of for demurrage.... something liddat....

 

The cranes mobilised for lifting is another big ticket item.

 

Total costs will be higher than ocean freight for sure.

 

Do not wory so much. One fare hike will resolve all these issues. Sup sup water lah.

 

Must get more ppl to give up their cars so that they can get more from the fare hike. Support car-lite city, yo.

[Wt_know]

why no sound no air from smrt and local media to report cheapo trains got problem in prior?

if ownself reported first ... probably can sugarcoat the message and manage expectations/reactions

why must wait until hk media pecah lobang ... when someone pecah lobang ...

no matter how it's already in bad publicity ...

in today edge of new media and internet ... they still believe can cover up?

they think sinkies only read ST and watch ch 5 news? muahahaha

Edited July 7, 2016 by Wt_know

[Kezg1]

Do not wory so much. One fare hike will resolve all these issues. Sup sup water lah.

 

Must get more ppl to give up their cars so that they can get more from the fare hike. Support car-lite city, yo.

 

 

yup...those retard will do so on the hike...just like carparks...so wtf are all those being paid millions a year and have the cheek to try and cover up..no wonder we are 154th in transparency...enuf said.

[Count-Bracula]

Sorry . . I just came back from Mars. Si mi dai ji this LTA thingy?

 

I must start reading from the start of this saga when I have the time

Edited July 7, 2016 by Count-Bracula

[RadX]

Sorry . . I just came back from Mars. Si mi dai ji this LTA thingy?

 

I must start reading from the start of this saga when I have the time

 

 

liddat you shd go back to UR-anus then...closer to MARS  

[Bismarck]

Do not wory so much. One fare hike will resolve all these issues. Sup sup water lah.

 

Must get more ppl to give up their cars so that they can get more from the fare hike. Support car-lite city, yo.

More people give up car and take public transport, more will be at the mercy of fare hike with no other options available, more revenue for Smrt/temasak holdings.